Sid: One new humanity and when you can understand this then you can step out of all the generational cures going all the way back to Adam. And when you can understand the blessings through revelation knowledge that your supposed to walk into. I don’t know anyone that can teach you better than Dr. Francis Myles. On yesterday’s broadcast we found out that Francis was literally wasting away, he was under 100 pounds. It was painful, he went to doctors, they couldn’t help him; he went to witchdoctors and they couldn’t help him. One night he literally his spirit leaves his body and starts moving up out of his body. And I imagine the freedom you felt Francis had to be so phenomenal when you slipped out of your earth suit. What was that freedom like?
Francis: Oh, Sid it was freedom of freedom; you know you have never been any more alive. I’ve never been any more alive than when I was in that moment; because we have… people don’t realize that we have just how much our fallen human body has been glorified because you know our body will eventually be glorified. But our spirit has already ascended when you’re born again into becoming one with the Messiah.
Sid: Okay so you’re slipping up and then a golden hand reaches out because you’re involved in warfare with a top demon; a demon prince. And you don’t know what to do and this golden hand reaches out and then what happens?
Francis: So this golden hand reaches out and what I see about the golden hand is there is a nail imprint, you know a big hole where you could see that was a nail imprint. And I knew instantly this was the hand of the Lord the Messiah. It stays up in the air and as soon as it stayed up in the air the Lord begins to talk to me. He says to me “Son this is a demonic prince who was assigned to kill you before your time; but you will live and not die.” And all of a sudden He’s talking to me this demonic prince lashes for me and so we begin to go into a wrestling match right in the presence of the hand of God; of the hand of the Messiah and the glory of God surrounded this entire event. But again there’s no fear inside of me; while I was fighting this demonic prince it’s that the battle is 50/50 he can’t overpower me, I can’t overpower him. But there’s no fear in me and then all of a sudden a door opens in the middle of the Messiah and a door opens and a scroll comes out.
Sid: A scroll came out and then what?
Francis: A scroll comes out a blue scroll comes out of His golden hand; a door just opens up in the middle of His hand a door opens up and a scroll comes out. And then He speaks to me He says “Son, use My word and the scroll comes out and Sid it went right from the top of my head into the word. The word went right from my… I caught it; when the scroll came I caught it and the scroll when into me. I mean completely filled me up and all of a sudden you must remember when this encounter is happening I’m only one month born again. So I’m a baby in Christ when it comes to the Word. So the only scripture I know is John 3:16 that’s the only one that I could memorize. “For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son that whosoever shall believe Him shall not perish.” That’s the only scripture I know Sid at this point and so I say it; it comes up and I say it. I was shocked to see the authority of the word. I was shocked to see the authority of the word, all of a sudden when I said it there was a lightning. I mean a lightning from one end of the heavens to the next and then it thundered, I’m telling you it’s almost like if you’ve ever had a thunderstorm you multiply that thunderstorm by a million times. The sound of it was paralyzing I thought everybody in the neighborhood is going to jump out of bed it’s so powerful. The next moment all I know is that the demonic prince is fallen to my feet lying prostrate before me shaking, shaking literally the demon was shaking from head to toe with fear and I could smell his fear.
Sid: So you’re telling me that demon was afraid of the Word of God.
Francis: He was afraid of the Word of God because before the Word our fight was 50/50 he couldn’t bring me down, I couldn’t bring him down. But as soon as the Lord said “Son take the Word,” when the Word came into me and I just quoted just one verse that you don’t even associate with spiritual warfare you know. Most people we know about that as a salvation scripture but very rarely could you associate John 3:16 to fight a demon but that was what God used.
Sid: The Word is so powerful and you as a baby believer you began to understand. So the demon shakes and runs away in fear from the Word of God; you slip back into your body, and I understand that before this experience you were under 100 pounds and you were wasting away, you were in horrible pain; sores are all over your body. When you got back into your body what happened to your sickness?
Francis: Oh my God as soon as I got back in the body I woke up and I knew instantly something was different about my body. The pain that I’d lived with for 3 years constantly unyielding was gone Sid, you know and the boils began to slowly wear away; by the morning…
Sid: The boils were all gone by the morning?
Francis: By the morning everything was gone.
Sid: I’ll tell you the impact that that had on you you end up in Bible school. You have a problem. They have a camp meeting and it’s a bunch of white pastors and you’ve had so much discrimination in your life you don’t want anything to do with it; but God had something else in mind. You get up and you go to pray you’re in a nice hotel just before you’re going to speak. You don’t know what to do except give these white pastors the business for being so anti-black and so insensitive to you. And all of a sudden you’re praying and you see a white couple right by you what happened?
Francis: Oh yes, you know I have gone through incredible racial prejudice as a black man living at a Bible college which was all white for the most part and this is in South Africa. So what ends up happening is that I become very very bitter towards white people. I mean extremely bitter and in my hatred for white people my unforgiveness rises. So one of my white pastors calls me and says “One of the All White Pastors Conferences in Johannesburg; and they asked me to speak but I declined and I offered your name and you’re going to be in my spot would you like to go?” And I’m like “Glory to God because I’m thinking this God vindication of my treatment and I’m going to tell these while pastors what they should have been hearing.” I mean it was not going to be a gracious Messianic message about the love of God; I was a bitter man. But on our way to the white Pastors Conference my friend had an idea he said “I want to treat you to a Five Star Hotel in a game park and so we get over there. Fast forward in the evening I feel like I need to go and pray and I’m praying in the bushes of this hotel that’s surrounded with national impact. I become aware that I’m being washed behind me and I turn around and it was this white couple, and so what I did I just kept quiet I said “Well, I kept quiet, if I kept quiet they’ll just past me and they’ll just go on their way.” And so and instead 2 minutes go by and they’re watching me and I’m like “God, why are they watching me, why are they watching me and they just pass by me and they go on their way?” And the Holy Spirit said “That’s because they’re stuck by My power on that spot.” He said “I will not let them pass you until you minister to them prophetically.” Sid I was so bad, I said “No to the Holy Ghost” I said “No, I’m not going to do that,” these are the white people, these are the people that have hurt me, why do want me to minister to these people that have hurt me.” And you know I gave all kinds of excuses, and the Holy Spirit said “No son you have to minister to them.” And then instantly I had a vision, as I’m arguing with the Holy Spirit I have a prophetic vision. I see the woman coming out of the doctor’s office and she’s crying and the Holy Spirit said “This man you see, this man you see is here at this resort to comfort his dear wife because this week the doctor told her she will never be able to bare children and she always wanted to be a mother, ‘but you are a prophet. If you pray for her and prophesy the Word of the Lord over her; I will heal her and I will give her a baby boy.’ and I saw another vision she’s holding a beautiful white baby boy.” This is not what I was expecting, this was not what I wanted but that’s what is happening.
Sid: So you you’re ready to give this prophetic word and pray for them to have a child and after the devastating news they got. And because of his prejudice he says “No.” However, a little later the Holy Spirit forces you to go back to him and he said “Yes.” And you pray for him and what happened?
Francis: Oh yeah, and so when he finally said “Yes, after he said “No and after he said “Yes.” As I’m looking at them all of a sudden did I feel like a vial of liquid love, a vial of liquid love is being poured from my forehead. It feels like it was the most overpowering love I’ve ever felt.
Sid: I’ll tell you what, hold that thought we’ll pick up there on tomorrow’s broadcast. But I can feel that liquid love just as you’re talking about it.
Sid: But the revelation that you have I’ve read lots of teaching on breaking generational curses. But I have never ever seen such a complete supernatural way of breaking these curses. They’re not just broken but they’re permanently broken. It’s not just the curses it’s all of them and then you can get rid of this sickness and family problems and even people’s destiny have been robbed by these curses.
SID: Amazing. Between three and 10,000 years ago, our civilization had electricity. How, L.A., is this possible?
L.A.: These stones in my chart, that we just talked about, the stone base of the Catholic Church, had electric properties or highly polished surfaces. They were carved from a quarry, in some cases, granite, a number of cases, anthrocite. These are just stones. And they’re able to sort of like crystal radios in the 20s and the 30s. That’s similar because they conduct electricity. What we believe is that there was an ancient grid system over this planet at one point with points of connectivity. This grid system may have been used not only as a communication, but perhaps to control the weather to bring rain in, all sorts of things.
SID: How could they have all this sophistication? I mean, just sophistication without a wheel moving the blocks. What explanation do you have?
L.A.: Well you have two. You have one, which is the extraterrestrial that they came from Zeta Reticula, which of course, I don’t believe in. The one I hold to and hold to very fast and diligently is we are looking at fallen angel technology. And we get some of this in the Book of Enoch, which tells us that they came and showed the secrets of Heaven to the men and women of Earth.
SID: Tell me about in the United States, in Ohio, the great circle mound. First, explain what is.
L.A.: The circle henge is a mound. It’s a very large circle, over 1,250 feet in diameter.
SID: The word “henge” means—
L.A.: Henge means this. It’s a circle, but it also has a waterway in the inside. And the construction of this is incredible because at least this particular henge dates about 3000, 3500 years ago, which again, fits the timeline of a diaspora when Joshua and Caleb were moving into with the Israelites, into the Promised Land and the Nephilim scattered. They show up there about 3000, 3500 years ago in the Ohio Valley. They create this circle, this henge with a body of water in the middle of it. In the center of it, excavations prove that there was an altar and they found human remains on the altar. And that’s huge.
SID: Okay. Tell me about the American Stonehenge connection with the, we hear about the Stonehenge in England and then a third place. Explain.
L.A.: Sure. The American Stonehenge is in New Hampshire.
SID: How come we haven’t seen this? How come we haven’t been told about this Stonehenge?
L.A.: Well things are coming to light. I believe because we’re in the last days that all this stuff which has been hidden is now coming to light for those of us who are interested.
SID: Well Daniel even says a sign of the last days there will be an information explosion. We always think, well that’s the computer. But it’s also other areas.
L.A.: Absolutely. The typical henge is a circle. And like many of these henges like Stonehenge, it charts astronomical events. What I mean by that, summer solstice, winter solstice, spring equinox, fall equinox. And the circle, when you stand in the center of the henge and you look out, there’s a standing stone, and that standing stone, let’s say is a hundred yards away. And so on summer solstice, the longest day of the year, you watch the sunrise come up over that standing stone. Well Kelsey Stone, a college student, was wondering, gee, I wonder if I extend the line from the center of my henge in New Hampshire out to the summer standing stone to see where it goes. So he begins to extend this line. He extends it further, extends it further across the Atlantic, and to his utter amazement it bisects dead center, the center trilithon in Stonehenge, England. And you can’t do that in antiquity. There’s no way you can’t take a long enough string and go across the Atlantic Ocean. It has to be done from the air.
SID: Audience, do you think thousands of years ago they had anything remotely close to this kind of technology? Doesn’t this show there was a super intelligence, and what the Bible talks about, the Nephilim?
L.A.: And what’s amazing, I talked to a surveyor. There’s no way to do anything like that unless you’re in the air. Who is the principal power of the air? It’s Satan. And this to me, once again, fallen angel technology. But it gets better. When you extend that line from New Hampshire and it intersects to the center trilithon in Stonehenge, when you continue that line, you wind up in Beirut, Lebanon. And Beirut, Lebanon is the home of the Phoenicians, and the Phoenicians are the descendants of the Canaanites, and the Canaanites were a Nephilim tribe.
SID: My goodness. So then you can see where some of them came to America.
SID: And that’s why they’re finding these skulls and these bones. Some of these bones they’re finding show that the people were how tall?
L.A.: Well there’s 9-footers, 10-footers and 11-footers, and even pushing the border up to 12 feet in some of these burial mounts. And again, going back to the Smithsonian, we have report after report from newspapers telling about once a town would exhume the bones and a doctor, a man of letters, would measure the articulated, this articulated skeleton and this dis-articulated skeleton where the bones are just laying all around. But the doctor, a man of letters, a hundred years ago, can read a tape measure. And yet when you talk to archeologist he will tell you they didn’t know how to measure, which is, in my opinion, a bunch of nonsense. So the Smithsonian would come in, they would confiscate the bones and crate them up, and you would never see them again. They were just gone.
SID: What a cover-up.
SID: Now how does this tie in based on all these years of research, and I might add, he heard from God to research the Days of Noah. Because of all the times in the Old Testament, Jesus said, it will be like the Days of Noah. Explain to me with all this research how it ties in with the Mark of the Beast.
L.A.: Well the Mark of the Beast has four characteristics. If anyone takes it or receives the mark on the hand or the forehead, you can’t buy, sell or trade without it. That’s the one we all know. The second one is men and women will seek death in those days but not find it. Well what days? The days of the mark, which coincides back to or points back to the Days of Noah, that lifespan seems to be extended. The third one is if you take the mark, grievous sores appear on the body. The fourth one, which is the most telling in my opinion, anyone who takes the mark winds up in the lake of fire. There’s no grace, no mercy. You’re in the lake of fire. And the same judgment that we see with the Nephilim in Genesis 6, Sodom and Gomorrah and what happens in Israel, the Promised Land when Joshua and Caleb came into the Promised Land, it’s always the same ending. If Nephilim is there the judgment is always the same. It’s total annihilation. There’s never a shred of grace and mercy.
SID: That’s my question. Why would someone in their right mind that knows what the Bible says even consider taking the Mark of the Beast?
L.A.: Because what is coming, this coming great deception, hinges on Darwinism. Darwinism tells us that there is no God, that we just evolved over billions of years. When Ben Stein sits down with Richard Dawkins, one of the premier evolutionists of the 20th and 21st centuries, and he says, “Where did life come from?” Dawkins says, “Maybe millions of years ago in another galaxy a race of highly evolved aliens created us and then seeded us here throughout the galaxy.” That’s what he believes. I call that the alien gospel. This is what’s coming, and it dovetails into Darwinism. Scientists and the masses, when they show up, the coming great deception, and they will show up, they will have two things for us: free energy, which powers their crafts. The second thing is they’ll have this DNA upgrade. And if a person takes this DNA upgrade his DNA will become altered. Yes, he will have no diseases for 500 years or more. Yes, he or she will live and all this, but the problem is you are no longer human. You become Nephilim and that’s why the Judgment in the Book of Revelation is exactly the same as Genesis 6. There’s a correlation between the two.
SID: Tell me about that recent press conference of the UFOs.
L.A.: That was in Washington, D.C. Senators, congressman, governors, Air Force pilots, people with top secret clearances all came on the record basically stating that the UFO phenomena is real. It’s burgeoning. It’s not going to go away. It’s increasing in numbers. This is the coming great deception. One event can change everyone’s worldview in a second. You see a mile-wide craft over your city, unless you know what you’re looking at, you will be deceived. And Jesus warns us that even the elect will be deceived if that were possible.
SID: Well you know, you started out talking about the Days of Noah. Well Jesus says, it will be like the Days of Noah and you will not, he will come at an hour you do not expect. So the issue is not what we’ve been talking about. The issue is are you ready. That’s the issue. You can only get ready with God’s supernatural change of DNA, and that is make Jesus your Messiah and Lord. Ask him to forgive you of your sins because he died for them, and ask him to live inside of you. It’s not complex. And I tell you, your DNA will be changed to be the way God created you to be. If you like the way things are right now then don’t change. But if you believe there’s something better, make Jesus your Messiah and Lord. Do you agree?
Sid: We want everyone everywhere to be SO RED HOT for the Messiah. I believe that God has given us keys for increase, and keys for blessing that the devil has literally taken out of Gentile Christianity. I have Pastor Robert Heidler on the telephone; he has a Master’s degree from Dallas school of theology. He’s pastor of Glory of Zion Outreach Center in Denton, Texas. We’re featuring his unpublished manuscript that is so important especially to what God is doing this year with the body of Messiah. It’s called the “Cycles of God.” It has to do with the Biblical festivals that have been stolen from the church that are coming back, not in bondage, not in tradition, but in truth and in “chofesh,” that’s a Hebrew word that means freedom. Now what did you mean that these cycles of God, Robert Heidler, are God’s key to increase and blessing?
Robert: God has given these as keys, not as legalistic structures that we have to obey, but He’s given them as keys that He wants to use in our lives to bring us closer to Him every time we go through them; closer to His blessing every time we go through them. They will cut off the strategies of the enemy in our lives, and they’ll open us to receive the blessing that God has for us.
Sid: See your book is a real how to book; to understand these blessings; understand the festivals; how to go about, and actually examples of how you have gone about celebrating these Biblical festivals. Well left off yesterday speaking about the fall feasts, explain.
Robert: Well every fall you’ve gone through, the year started with Passover in the first month, then there was Pentecost in the third month, then you go through a long hot summer and come into the fall. There is a cycle, there are 3 feasts clustered together in the fall because God wants us to end the year, to end the cycle of feasts in His presence, in His glory with the experience of His power. The fall feasts are really designed by God to move into that place of His presence, His power, and His glory. It’s interesting it begins with the Feast of Trumpets; the main thing that God asks of us in the Feast of Trumpets is that we hear the trumpet blast; it’s the day of the awakening call. Most of us over the course of a year we get to the point where we need an awakening call. We need to be called to alertness. So God says “Begin this time by listening to the trumpet blast. Let it do something in your spirit to wake you up to say this is the time to press in to the presence of God.” This is a time God has set to move to experience His glory. It’s interesting the 10 days after Trumpets, in the Jewish calendar are called the Days of Awe, they’re also called the Days of T’shuvah, which t’shuvah means to turn; to return; to repent. It also is the word for springtime, and God is saying “I want to bring you into a new season. I want to bring you into a season freshness of life.” That’s what Trumpets calls us into.
Sid: You know I also think of that when I think of Rosh Hashanah and Yom Kippur, I think about the shofar blast there is something so supernatural of the sound of a shofar.
Robert: Yeah it does something in our spirits when we hear that blast it causes something to activate in us to press into God.
Sid: Tell me a bit about Yom Kippur.
Robert: Well Yom Kippur is the holiest day of the year, it is just a special set apart day. It is the only day that God has on the Biblical calendar that’s a day of fasting and not a day of feasting. It’s a time to do serious business with God; it’s to make sure that every sin is under the blood if there is anything not confessed that’s not dealt with. It’s a time to make sure that there is nothing that stands between you and God; nothing that would hinder you from coming boldly into His presence. I think the verse I love for the Day of Atonement is Isaiah 44:22 when God says “I have wiped out your transgressions like a thick cloud, and your sins like a heavy mist. Return to me for I have redeemed you.” That’s what God is saying on the Day of Atonement. “Atonement has been made return to Me receive the full blessing, the full benefits of that.”
Sid: Now tell me one Yom Kippur that your church family observed and what you did.
Robert: I think one of the most significant ones we did…
Sid: And again, Yom Kippur means Day of Atonement. Go ahead.
Robert: We celebrate the feasts differently every year. There was one year we talked about the 2 goats; there was a goat that was the sin offering which was fulfilled by Jesus, but then there was a second goat. In celebrating Yom Kippur they would take that goat and confess over it the sins of the people then lead it out into the wilderness. It was a tangible reminder to the people that your sins have been confessed, they have been removed. So we had a time at the end of the service where we had the lights dimmed a little bit, and we gave everyone a sheet of paper that had 1 John 1:9 across the top “If we confess our sins He is faithful and righteous to forgive us our sins, and cleanse from all unrighteousness.” We said “Ask God if there are any sins that you are supposed to confess, anything that would hinder your walk with Him, and just write them down.” We gave people some time to do that. Then we said “Now turn your paper sideways and write across… claim 1 John 1:9 and write the words of that verse out across your list. ‘If we confess our sins He is faithful and righteous to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse’” We had a trashcan up front and we said “Now take that list and tear it up and throw it away.” People walked out there saying “I know there is no confessed sin, there is no sin God wants me to confess that I haven’t confessed. There’s nothing that would hinder my fellowship with Him.” It was just a time of sort of recreating the Day of Atonement of realizing we have dealt with everything that needs to be dealt with and we are ready to press into the presence of God.
Sid: Now you’re talking about my favorite fall feasts, Tabernacles.
Robert: Oh it is, it is the celebration of God.
Sid: In Hebrew it’s Sukkot.
Robert: Yes. The name comes from the fact that when Israel came into the wilderness they came out of Egypt and they dwelt in temporary shelters. God basically said “Build a temporary shelter for me too and I will come down into your midst and dwell with you.” So Tabernacles is a reminder of that time when God came down and dwelt in the midst of His people and they saw it and experienced His glory. That’s what Tabernacles is, it’s a time to remember the experience of the glory of God in the past, it’s a time to press in and to re-experience that manifestation of His glory.
Sid: Tell me about a Tabernacles that your church family observed.
Robert: I think the most memorable one, we took the whole week we decorated the inside of the church like a tabernacle, and we had 24 hour prayer and praise going 7 days a week through the entire week. We had a table where there was just continually food for feasting. Every night we had a different pastor in from a different church to do a message. During that week I’d go down to the church at three in the morning and there’d be 20 or 30 people in there singing and celebrating. By the end of the week there was such an experience of the presence of God there. I think that’s a picture of what God wants us to come into; He wants us to see “You can come into My presence, you can experience My goodness.” You know a lot of people don’t understand what the glory of God is, but glory is a tangible manifestation of His presence. I think all of us can remember those times when we knew God was speaking to us we were feeling His presence with us. God came down and touched us in a very significant way. That was the glory of God, and God wants us to remember the times in the past when we’ve experienced His glory, and He wants us to know there’s more glory ahead. He wants us to know more and more of His presence.
Sid: I just recently got such encouragement it’s almost like at times I feel like I’m a voice calling in the wilderness and wondering is anyone getting it, is anyone out there beginning to understand God’s plan for the next move of God’s Spirit. See I was involved in a move of God’s Spirit; I came to be a believer at the end of the Charismatic movement as a Jewish person that Jesus walked into my bedroom and He became real to me. I was one of the pioneers in what became known as the Messianic Judaism; I know what it is to fight for a vision, but I see something bigger, something greater, something that’s about ready to happen that doesn’t make any of the former moves wrong, they are right, they are of God. There is something bigger that is coming, and some of the missing blanks to my questions have been filled in by my guest. I have him on the telephone; I’m speaking to him at his office in his church, Glory of Zion Outreach Center in Denton, Texas, Pastor Robert Heidler. Robert it was an interesting God coincidence that I got to meet you, at least by telephone; that is a mutual friends the Schneier’s who have a Messianic Congregation in Odessa, Ukraine; told me about an unpublished manuscript and the more they told me about it the more I said “Can I borrow it?” They lent it to me; I devoured it and got you on the phone, and I said “We have got to get this to our Mishpochah.” You have a picture from your studies, and I might add, you have a Master’s in theology, from Dallas Theological Seminary. You have a scenario from your study of the scriptures and history of what the first church was like. Many times I wondered this, what happens when a thousand, two-thousand, three-thousand Jewish people that don’t even have a copy of the New Testament are struck with the reality of Jesus, and believe there can’t be much organization; there’s certainly aren’t church buildings; what was the first church like? If we can grasp what that first church was like maybe we can get some of the power that’s been missing for too long.
Robert: Amen, amen. You know when I began to study the early church and really began to read what was written about it at the time. It was a revelation because it was unlike anything we have ever seen or even imagined. So many people today think of the early church, you know, the day after Pentecost Peter went out and rented a building and put a steeple on top, and put up a sign that said “First Baptist Church of Jerusalem.” We don’t stop to think what the early church really was because most of the things we think of as church, would not be invented for another thousand years; yet they had a life and a power that the church today has not even imagined.
Sid: Paint me a picture from the best of your research of what the first church looked like.
Robert: Well I think there was several things that would characterize the early church. One was, it was a church overflowing with joy; I mean they met in homes, they met in the temple courts, they met in out in the fields. Basically, the meeting place was not significant; they just met wherever they could. There gatherings were filled with joyful singing and dancing. One of my favorite quotes about the worship of the early church comes from Clement of Alexandria about 250 A.D.; he described their worship this worship this way “The daughters of God lead in a ring dance; the righteous are the dancers; the music is a song of the King of the universe; the maidens strike the lyre; the angles praise; the prophets speak; the sound of music issues forth; they run in pursuit of the jubilant band; those that are called make haste eagerly desiring to receive the Father.” So it’s just a picture of just an overflowing joyful celebration in the presence of God.
Sid: When he spoke about dancing in a circle, the first thing that came to mind is the Israeli dances, the Hora etcetera, they are all circle dances.
Robert: Yeah that was very typical of the early church. They would begin by doing those circle dances. We picture the angles around the throne of God in heaven; in Revelation 4:5 we picture them all standing there, in the early church they picture them all doing ring dances around the throne. So when they got together they would join in with the ring dances of the angels.
Sid: That’s interesting because some of my friends that have the gift of discernment that can see angels, they say when they go into services and they see people dancing they see angles all around the people dancing. Dancing the exact same way that they are, which almost like this quote you had from Clement.
Robert: Yeah. It’s such a different picture of church than most Christians today have because most Christians think of the early church as sad and somber; it really was not. You read the quotes and joyful celebration dancing… St. Basil in the fourth century said “Could there be anything more blessed than to imitate on the earth the ring dance of the angels.”
Sid: Okay, let’s suppose you’re going to visit, and according to your manuscript these were house churches. So you go to a house church, tell me what you see with your eyes as you’re entering.
Robert: Well I think as you come in, if we were to walk into a house church back in the late first century, it would look like there’s a party going on. People are just rejoicing, they’re dancing, they’re celebrating, and after a time of praise and worship the presence of God comes into the meeting. At some point they’ll bring out food and they’ll eat together, it’s a big family celebration.
Sid: You know I was telling you that I’ve just started One New Man Shabbat celebrations. What you’ve just said has triggered me now because there was a presence of God from the very beginning of the last one we had of our Shabbat celebration. There was point where all of a sudden there was a release of God’s glory and healings broke out like popcorn.
Robert: That’s what you see in the early church. It talks about in the early writings, and even in the New Testament that the presence of God would come down… when they came together they formed a temple and the glory of God came tangibly down in the midst and the result was an outflow of the miraculous. Irenaeus wrote about 195, and he said that “When they got together it’s very common for prophetic words, tongues, miracles of healing,” and then he added “The church frequently saw people raised from the dead by the prayers of the saints.” That’s sort of an exciting church to be in.
Sid: Yeah tell me where they meet and I’ll be there! By the way, when did they meet, the first church?
Robert: Well it’s interesting, first of all they met a lot of times in places, but they had their weekly reunion usually in the first century at least, on Saturday night. It was really sort of a picture, I think, of the Friday night Shabbat where they were used to meeting together in homes for Shabbat, and they would sing and eat together, and praise and worship God, as part of their Jewish background. So on Saturday night, which really began the first day of the week, they would meet back together in small groups and do the same thing in celebrations of Yeshua.
Sid: So to understand the Shabbat dinner in a home on a Friday night, in a Jewish home, would give us insight as to what they naturally did in the first church.
Robert: Exactly. It’s interesting down to details, like if you read early writings there was a special prayer, or a special song that was sung at the beginning when the church came together; it was a special song or prayer as they lit the lamps. Just as Shabbat was welcomed, when the mother of the house would light the Shabbat candles, so they would welcome the presence of the Lord with a special prayer to light the lamps at the start of the church service. So in detail, I think they learned how to worship together as a church through the Friday night Shabbat times.
Sid: This is Sid and I’m speaking to Pastor Robert Heidler about his unpublished manuscript.
Sid: My guest by way of telephone at his home in Columbus, Ohio is Rabbi Kirt Schneider; Rabbi Schneider is Rabbi over Adat Adonai Messianic Jewish Congregation in Toledo, Ohio. He also teaches Jewish root and evangelism to the church with his ministry Shalom Ministries. On yesterday’s broadcast we found out that Kirt was raised in a Jewish home; both parents Jewish; was Bar Mitzvah’d in a conservative synagogue but like many Jewish people of his generation did not know the scriptures. His understanding of a Christian was someone that wore – he had one friend because all of his other friends were Jewish, wore a big cross around his neck. But that cross had zero to do with intimacy with God through Jesus, it just was a fashion statement. Kirt’s god became wrestling, his whole identity was wrapped up in wrestling. Is it true that you went down to almost nothing in weight so that you could perhaps you felt you could become a champion by being at that low weight? It sounds like you were almost emaciated.
Kirt: Well, it’s true – it’s true and looking back on it I mean it was perhaps a mistake. The idea of you know if you can get down to a lower weight you’ll be wresting smaller guys but of course you forget a little bit that when you’re that low you’ll be as small as they are. So I did I was basically all skin and bone and muscle to begin with.
Sid: And you also did this with visualization, you would see yourself winning and even to the point of getting goose bumps you told me yesterday.
Kirt: That’s true I’d lay on my bed at night and envision myself with my hand raised as State Champ and chills would go through my body; this went on for years.
Sid: So did you become the State Champ?
Kirt: No I didn’t I was a very good wrestler I got to the place where there wasn’t anybody that I felt I couldn’t beat. I did get a small scholarship to wrestle in college, but here’s the thing, when I walked off the wrestling mat after wrestling my last match in high school even though I had a partial scholarship to college when I walked off that wrestling mat Sid in high school it was like the world was pulled out from under my feet after I wrestled that last match. Because suddenly I realized that I was moving into a world that was a lot bigger than people that wrestled at 119 pounds. You see for years the only world that I lived in were people that wrestled my weight class and I felt in control in that environment and feeling in control I felt the sense of peace, I had an identity, it was just a good feeling but when I walked off that mat for the last time in high school I realized that you know what I had been living in an illusion; that the world that I was moving into was much more complex it was made up of many more people than people that wrestled 119 pounds. And in an instant Sid it was like I went from feeling on top of the world and in control of life to suddenly in a twinkling of an eye feeling as if I was out of control, insignificant without purpose and without identity it was a terrifying experience. I didn’t know during those years that there was a devil, because being raised in a Jewish home we just never talked about the devil. No one had told me about him but I’ll tell you what during those two years of struggle between the time that wrestling ended in high school, and the time that Yeshua revealed Himself to me at 20 years old I literally felt Satan on me, literally feeling him taking possession of me, laughing at me and making me laugh at myself with his own laughter. Totally destroying me, the Bible says “That he came to steal, and kill and destroy,” and if the Lord would not have come to me at 20 years old supernaturally in a vision in the night and reveal himself to me Sid I would have been absolutely destroyed by Satan.
Sid: Well you know that there’s a lot of your background that is similar to mine; for instance your god was wresting, my god was money.
Sid: And my desire was to become a millionaire by age 30, so you went from wresting to wanting make money but that didn’t work out too well for you did it.
Kirt: It really didn’t and I knew personally that money wasn’t my answer because I come from a fairly wealthy background and I had seen the people in my neighborhood that they had problems just like everybody else. But I didn’t know what else to do so grasping for straws I thought maybe if I made a lot of money it will help to make me feel better. And it as during that time that Yeshua revealed Himself to me.
Sid: Well, you actually dabbled a little as I did as many Jewish people do in the New Age.
Kirt: That’s true I went down to California seeking out one of the shrines, one of the Yogi’s there Par Mongeo Condo and in fact it was while I was reading a book about middle eastern religion an autobiography of Yogi by Par Mongeo Condo that Yeshua appeared to me in the middle of the night.
Sid: Tell me about that night; that was back in 1978 you were 20 years of age; tell me what you remember about that night.
Kirt: Well, a little background I had dropped out of college, I was selling encyclopedias door to door for the purpose of making enough money to travel the country to find a location for a discotheque I wanted to open and it’s a long story.
Sid: What is it about us Jewish people I wanted to do all that too but go ahead.
Sid: Actually I did but go ahead. (Laughing)
Kirt: Long story short I’m promoted to a sales manager in this company and I get to a sales managers meeting one day we’re waiting for the other managers to arrive and this guy tells me about this book he’s reading the autobiography of a Yogi. I purchase the book, I’m reading the book, I’m devouring the book; there’s pictures in there Sid of this guy levitating off the ground supposedly. So I said “God,” I always had a faith in God I said “God if this is real if this guy can really levitate off the ground I said then this is a higher reality than making money.” And I thought to myself Sid and think how good I’d feel levitating off the ground, so I became like my new…I became so focused on this. And one night in the middle of reading this book I came home and I went to sleep I had a terrible headache this night, I wasn’t drunk, I wasn’t on drugs I just remember this night I had a terrible, terrible headache. I went to sleep, once again I want to make the point no one had ever witnessed to me, no one had ever told me about Jesus, I had no exposure to Yeshua whatsoever, but at 20 years old in 1978 at 3:30 in the morning as I slept in my bedroom at 3217 Bremerton Road in Pepper Pike, Ohio. The Lord awoken me from my sleep. My eyes were still closed but suddenly I was aware that I wasn’t sleeping it was a state of conscience awareness. And in that state Sid it lasted no more than 2 or 3 seconds it as if I was transported into another dimension; suddenly it was like I was being transported to a tunnel almost and suddenly Jesus appeared on the cross, it was in color, I could see the terrain; I could see people in the distance. I read later in the book of Luke chapter 23 of verse 49 “That the disciples looked on Him at a distance.” I believe the Lord supernaturally Sid, transported me in a vision in a vision of the night in a dream to see the site of the crucifixion. And as I was observing this a ray of red light from straight through the sky beamed down on Jesus’ head. When I saw the ray of light Sid from straight through the sky beam down on his head I knew that it was coming from God since it was coming from straight above. And I knew that God was telling me that somehow I was connected with this Jesus. Even though no one had ever witnessed to me as an American I knew enough to at least know that the person on the cross was Jesus.
Sid: Yeah, but didn’t you know that we Jews don’t believe in Jesus or that’s what we’ve been told?
Kirt: Well, I did but the thing is that to me it was just like kind of nonissue in my home, I mean I had no idea what I was about to encounter when I told my parents that I believed in Jesus. Because like I said I mean I just; we never talked about him one way or the other I mean I knew I was a Jew and Jews didn’t believe in Jesus but it never really dawned on me what the outcome of this…
Sid: So they were they excited as you?
Kirt: I thought they would be because I was so excited and you know I ran up to my Dad after I eventually got a New Testament and I said “Dad look at this verse here.” You know I was so excited I thought he would see how excited Jesus really was. Well they hired Sid one of the most famous deprogrammer in the country to kidnap me and deprogram me. His name was Ted Patrick, he’s been on major television shows and…
Sid: Yeah, I know I’ve read about Mr. Patrick. Why would you parents send you to such a high level programmer like that?
Kirt: I think that they were very embarrassed, I think that it would have been equivalent to me being thrown in jail. Here I was their Jewish son walking around their Jewish neighborhood telling all the neighbors about Jesus. I think they were absolutely just completely befuddled they had no idea what they could do.
Sid: Were you tricked into seeing him?
Kirt: I was. My dad said to me “We are going to talk to somebody about purchasing a restaurant.” And we drove to a hotel in Cleveland and I thought we were going to be speaking to somebody about a restaurant deal and we walk into the hotel room and my mom, dad and I walk in. There’s three people in the room a short distinguished looking guy in a three piece suit, two other guy of over 6′ both of them over 200 lbs. The door closes behind me once we’re all in the room and the short distinguish Ted Patrick says to me “We’re going to talk about cults, and then they flipped on the projector and started showing me the film of the Hari Krishna and they pointed to a little kid in the film a three or four year old. And they said “See that kid there’s nothing we can do for that kid, all that kid has ever known is the Hari Krishna but you have been living like a normal person for twenty years and we’re going to snap you out of this thing. I consider it a personal challenge,” and I sat up and I said “Listen I said I’m not programed, I said that I just believe that Jesus is the Yeshua the Messiah.” He said “Then you got nothing to worry about.” And I said “Well, can I leave” and one of the big goons said sit down.” And from there it was very clear I wasn’t getting out of the room, I asked permission to go to the bathroom in the room. Got on my knees and said “Lord please keep me.”
Sid: And now was your father in the room the whole time?
Kirt: Yes, yes he was in the room the whole time.
Sid: Didn’t you just appeal to him and say “Dad get me out of here?”
Kirt: No, it didn’t even occur to me because I knew that that wasn’t going to happen. But you know what I wasn’t scared and the bottom line was that it wasn’t an intense experience. What happened was a little bit after that they said “We’re going to take you to our rehabilitation home in California you’re going to live there and you’re going to snap out of this thing. But the reality was one of the big goons, I don’t know what other terminology to use he did not leave my side, he came back with me to my home in Pepper Pike, Ohio that night so that I couldn’t run away. The next day we got in my van and we drove to California to the rehabilitation house. The rehabilitation house was run by this big partier that actually was his son that really was just… and they whole they didn’t do anything and all they did was take me to the beach in the days and…
Sid: I’ll tell you what, hold that thought we’re just about out of time we’re pick up here on tomorrows broadcast.