Sid: We want everyone everywhere to know that people are being raised from the dead. That the same miracles that we read about in the Bible are taking place before our very eyes. We have the most documented miracle I have ever seen anywhere, short of course in the Bible, of a man that was dead for 3 days. He was dead according to the doctors, he was dead according to the mortuaries, so dead they injected chemicals inside of him that he had not been dead he would have died from the chemicals at the mortuary. But his wife received a visitation and was told he would come back to life and she tenaciously went to the mortuary took the body under false pretenses not… she wasn’t going to say “I know he’ll be healed.” She said “I just want to bury him.” So she takes the body, she brings it to a meeting that Reinhard Bonnke is speaking, Reinhard doesn’t even know about this. They decide it will cause too much confusion for a hearse, and a casket, and a body inside being taken into the meeting. So they finally decide “We’ll take him out of the casket and carry him to the basement so it won’t be any disturbance.” During the meeting they see signs of life and they start praying for all… now he’s down in the basement but they see he comes back to life. Reinhard Bonnke what happened next?
Reinhard: Well he comes back to life, I had finished preaching, I was already in the office of the pastor, I had to hurry by chartered aircraft back to Lagos to make my connection to my gospel crusade which was imminent. I had just gone to Onitsha by way of a detour and as a favor to a friend of mine and then while I was in the office the announcement was made in the church that in the basement a man was raised from the dead. I mean I have never heard such hysteric, joyful shouts in my whole life. I thought the roof of the cathedral was caving in. It was awesome and we were told that this man has come back to life, he has come back to life! They carried him up into the church. He still was oblivious of everything that went on around him.
Sid: Was he… you said he had rigor mortis that set in he was like concrete.
Reinhard: He was like concrete they massaged his body, the limbs began to move and everything, and that’s when they carried him up. So it took a few hours before he was able to recognize his wife and his son, and when he was able to respond to questions. His first word was “Where is my notepad?” He actually used the word that is used in Nigeria, file. He said “Where is my file?”
Sid: Why did he want this?
Reinhard: Well I will come to that a little later because this is connected with the second part of this great miracle. Because when he died we know what happened to the body, that’s what we had been talking about so far. The second part is what happened to his spirit. Later on I asked Pastor Daniel, I said “What about the injuries you suffered from? The accident when you came back to life, have you had pain?” He said to me “I have pains.” I said “What pains do you have? From the accident?” He said “No not from the accident I have great pains from the terrible massage” (Laughing).
Reinhard: You know there was not a scratch on his body from his injuries. It all totally vanished and his heart was perfect, his ribs were perfect, his lungs are perfect, it is absolutely incredible, absolutely incredible! So Pastor Daniel was then taken by his family. He went back to his home village, there was great, great rejoicing. He went back to the doctor who had issued the death certificate. The doctor said “I am absolutely shocked!” He went back to the mortician who fell on his knees and got gloriously saved and born again with his whole family as a result of it. Then neighbors came, the people came, they had to hide him just for a couple of days just to kind of recuperate. Now he joined me on the conference in Vienna. In Austria he gave his testimony there. It is amazing! He has framed his Death Certificate; I think is the only man on earth who has a framed Death Certificate hanging in his own home.
Sid: What I would like to know Reinhard is during those 3 days that he was dead does he have any recollection of what happened?
Reinhard: He has no recollection of what happened to his body, but this is his story. He says that when he was in the ambulance telling his wife what to do with the church, and what to do with the children, and the home and the house and she was crying and weeping and wailing. He said that suddenly 2 angels entered the ambulance, he knew he was going to die. He said one angel took him by the left hand and the other by the right hand and he left the ambulance. He said to me later “I did not know that I left my body behind.” He was totally oblivious of the fact that he had died and sense of just… in terms of just leaving his body behind. Those 2 angels handed him over to a great majestic angel he said who had treated him as a friend. The first thing that great angel did was given him a notepad, a file as they call it in Nigeria. And he said to Him and that he would take him to places and he would have to write down everything he sees. The first station he took him to was Paradise where he saw the saints worshipping the Lord. He said at first he mistook them for angels but he said these were the saints. He was told that these were the saints worshipping the Lord. My question to him was “Did you see Jesus?” He said “No! I saw a white bright light.” He said I shaded my eyes I tried to penetrate it but my eyes could not penetrate it.” But he said “The saints could look through that light and they were worshipping.” He said “It was so wonderful” he wanted to go in and join them there and just worship and worship and worship. The great angel said to him “No I have to show you more I want to show you the mansions that Jesus has built for His saints. He said “We never travelled, the moment the angel spoke in the twinkling of an eye we were there.” He said “I saw many mansions, fabulous mansions.” He said “So glorious I can’t describe them. It’s like like like like this… like like like that… like like like the other.…” He lacked words to describe what he saw. He said “You know I saw flowers music came out of the flowers. They were waving in rhythm.” He said “It was so fabulous, it was so glorious he just wanted to remain there and stay there. So the angel said to him “The mansions are ready but the saints are not.” So then the angel said to him “I’ve got to show you hell as well.” And he said within a nanosecond he stood with the angel in front of the gate of hell. And he said “Above the gate of hell was written in great letters ‘Welcome to the gate of hell.’”
Reinhard: He said it looked to him as if those gates hadn’t moved in a thousand years. The mighty angel next to him lifted up his hand and when he put down his hand with an awesome noise those gates began to open. In these and he looked right into hell. He said he saw multitudes upon multitudes of people in hell. He said they were all dressed like we are. He said “There were all races, there were black and white, and brown, and yellow, and all shapes and sizes and forms.” And he said “Although I could see no fire these people were in great great torment.” He said “They were cannibalizing themselves, they were eating themselves” he said. “They wanted to die and ate themselves but when they ate themselves the flesh jumped back to the place from which it had been eaten,” then the torment started again. He said “It was so horrible.” He said he saw people screaming at him, they could see him he said but not the angel next to him. One man shouted to him and said “I was a pastor on earth. I was pastoring a church. I stole money from that church. Help me to return that money!” But he said “I could not help anybody,” he said “It shook me so much because I was a pastor myself.” He said “The horror he felt was indescribable and these people were in torments of hell which could not be addicted.”
Sid: Ah Reinhard we’re out of time.
Sid: I’ll tell you Shane Wall and I are having so much fun here I’m glad you came for Something More because you’re going to get it I promise you. When was the last time you heard a message on understanding. How many times have you heard or you said “I just don’t understand this, I don’t understand why this good believer got a horrible disease and died?” Well this is what the Bible says in Proverbs 4:7 “With all of your getting get understanding.” You looked up the word get in the Hebrew what does it mean?
Shane: To get means to acquire for ones self, in other words when you get understanding you have it for your need your usage and we get understanding from God Himself.
Sid: This is such an important topic 300 times it talks about this understanding it’s a supernatural dimension that comes from God Himself. But I’ve never heard a message on this subject and everyone is questioning so much today that this going to be something more for you to put everything together. Now Shane you came from a Pentecostal background you got saved as a child. As a matter of fact when your mother was expecting you…
Sid: There were prophecies about you what did they say?
Shane: People one person picked my mother out of the audience and ministered to her and they said “That child that’s in your belly is anointed.” So my family knew from that point “That wow!” We have had preachers because her uncle’s were preachers. My mother had 5 uncles who were preachers and they wanted a boy. I was a miracle baby, after my mother heard from the doctor “You can’t have any more children.” And 10 years later here comes Shane.
Shane: (Laughing) So it was a miracle.
Sid: Now it says here that at 15 you began preaching.
Shane: I started preaching.
Sid: Did people know that you were going to be in ministry?
Shane: They did growing up in church everybody knew that I was going to be a preacher, the words of knowledge that would come, the words of prophesy from the visiting evangelists that would come through would just pick me out and “God has a great work for you to do, God has put His word in you.” And so I just knew coming up I am going to preach.
Sid: Tell me about the dream that you had at age 4.
Shane: I was 4 years old Sid and I dreamt that my family and I were out in the den just watching TV as normal. After eating and there was a certain scene, it was a black and white TV movie, and there was a certain scene that came up and this woman’s face was on the screen. And she was making an expression with her face for something that just happened. And I got up and I went to the restroom when I went to go to the restroom I saw my father sitting on the side of their bed crying. And so I ran back out into the den and I said “Momma daddy’s crying” and that was that was the end of the dream.
Sid: Hm okay.
Shane: That was it the very next night just a regular family time eating I’m sitting there watching the movie and at 4 years old I see the same scene, the same expression of the same woman’s face and at 4 I remember this Sid as if it happened this morning. I said to myself “Oh, this is when I’m supposed to go to the bathroom because I just had the dream.” And so I felt like this was like a play and this is my part in the play.
Sid: You’re just playing out what you saw in your dream.
Shane: Exactly and so I got up went to the bathroom and was shocked my father was sitting on the side of his bed crying. I ran out…
Sid: Exactly what you saw in the dream.
Shane: Exactly what I saw in the dream and so I ran out to the den and I said “Momma daddy’s crying.” Sadly enough someone had just murdered his brother in Washington, DC. And so that was the beginning…
Sid: How do you process this as a 4 year old?
Shane: I just thought…
Sid: It was natural maybe.
Shane: I guess so, supernaturally naturally supernatural to the point to where I didn’t even think about it it was like I did what I was suppose to do I did what I was shown and it was natural for me.
Sid: And it was nat…I mean talk about you know the Bible says you’re supposed to provoke the Jew to jealousy but this is ridiculous at 5 you start seeing angels.
Shane: Yes exactly.
Sid: Now when you would see them they were just conscious they were there or did you actually see them?
Shane: I actually saw the angels it started in Mrs. Bearings class I was 5 years old in kindergarten when I first started seeing the angels. And I wasn’t afraid of the angels they were very comforting and they still are very very comforting when I see them. But sometimes you don’t know why the angels are there so I ask the Holy Spirit “Why are the angels here or why is the angel here?” And sometimes the angel is there because sometimes he something that he came directly out of the very presence of God to deliver. Sometimes Sid I’ll see 2 angels. I remember a few times specifically when I’m ministering I’ll see 2 angels and the Holy Spirit said to me “One is a warring angel and one is a ministering angel.” The warring angel came through some stuff through the spirit realm so that the ministering angel could deliver what he had to deliver. So sometimes the Holy Spirit said to me “Sometimes God will pair a warrior angel with a ministering angel.”
Sid: Okay when you see the angel could you describe the way one might look of what you see?
Shane: You know for about the past 7 minutes Sid there has been an angel standing right behind you.
Sid: You know I was going to ask you that (Laughing).
Shane: For real there’s an angel standing right behind you and he’s about 9 to 10 feet tall and around his belt is like a blue cord and the blue cord is tied in the front. But off of his shoulders are like blue fringes there’s some blue fringes very muscular built standing straight.
Sid: Straighter than me okay.
Shane: Yeah exactly standing straighter than you are and his expression is as if he is waiting for a command. He’s standing there as if he’s waiting for a command but I sense so strongly that he’s assigned to you, that he is assigned to you.
Sid: Well you know what sometime during Something More I will hear what to command and it will happen.
Sid: Now when you’re ministering.
Sid: There’s many times there’s angels in fact you see them lined up.
Shane: Yes there was one particular time in the small town, small church and the angels appeared they had 2 sections in the church which made a middle aisle and they lined up. And so I’m just beginning you know thank you all for inviting me and things like that nature and the Holy Spirit says to me “Count the angels.” So you know I’m still talking but in my head I’m counting the angels and then he lead me to declare it and I told the people “There are 9 angels here tonight they are lined up in the center aisle.” And so then Sid I preached the message and as I often see some of the angels will line up at the back of the room and while I’m preaching or while I’m about to finish or whatever they start flapping their wings violently.
Sid: What does that mean to you?
Shane: To me the Holy Spirit said to me “When you see that it’s time for you to move in the gifts of the Spirit, it’s time for you to move in deliverance.” So at that point I saw those angels and so I began and I always like to start with salvation an altar call for salvation. So I called and I just really, really gave my heart for what the Holy Spirit said so at that point the people came up. I was about to pray the Holy Spirit said “Count the people.” And so I’m still about to pray prepare myself to lead into He said “Count the people.”And I did it was 9 people.
Shane: And so I said to the audience I said “Do you remember how many angels the Lord said were here earlier that He showed me? And He said 9,” I said “How many people are up there?” It was an uproar it was an uproar.
Sid: One angel for each person.
Shane: Exactly exactly the 9 people who were there. God assigns angels many times to individuals sometimes the Lord has something He wants to give to an individual and He will use His angelic host to come and bring His gifting to that individual.
Sid: Tell me about of this lady that had a lump on her side for 6 years.
Shane: Oh that was remarkable another time that the angels lined up at the back of the church it was the building that our church had before the one that we currently have. And they were lined up. So I began to minister and the Lord said “Call for those that need healing.” And so I did and this one lady came up and she and her family would visit every Sunday morning. So she came up for prayer and so I asked her “What was going on? And she said “I’ve had this lump on my side and I don’t know what it is.” So I prayed for her, now we talked earlier about being a nice Christian I don’t like my hands especially on certain parts of a lady so I asked one of the sisters of the church to put her hand there and I put my hand on top of hers. And so I prayed and so after that she told me Sid the lump got larger (Laughing).
Sid: Wait a second now that not the way it’s supposed to be scripted look at my script (Laughing) no.
Shane: Exactly and so it got larger and she said “Pastor Wall I’ve got to tell you.” Her name is Penny I’ve got tell you what happened. “Pastor Wall I told one of my co-workers what the doctors said “It was a cancer and what type it was. I started crying because my co-worker said ‘My sister died with the same cancer.’ But the doctor told me… asked me ‘How long have you had this?’” And when she told them they said “No way” so they did a biopsy found out that it was cancer. But they found something else out all of the tissue that had grown after I prayed isolated that cancer so it could not spread so they were able to go in tear it all out, clean it all out no complications she has had zero complications, so that was the miracle when it grew.
Sid: Well that is a great miracle now I am so intrigued with how God has taught you about understanding from the Bible.
Sid: And it really, it really started in 2008 when your mother unexpectedly died.
Shane: Yes Sir.
Sid: Tell me about that.
Shane: Well my mother she passed away in her sleep. It was a Sunday morning I didn’t know what was going on my father called me and we were just “What in the world was going on and so I rushed to their house and once I got there I saw her on the stretcher and they were rolling her to the ambulance. And they said “Just meet us at the hospital, just meet us at the hospital and so we went and we go there and they said “Well go in the waiting room.” I kind of felt what had happened I mean she wasn’t ill deathly ill of anything of that nature.
Sid: There’s no preparation for this.
Shane: None whatsoever.
Shane: So the doctor came into the waiting room and he asked us what happened and so we told her she had like a cold. And we said “Why don’t you go to the doctor for what for what I just get a little pain right here whenever I’m breathing in my clavicle but I’m fine.” Well I said “I’ll call an ambulance.” She said “For what?” That night is when she passed away.” And so I told the doctor everything and he said “We did everything we could but she did pass.” I said “Okay.” So he said “After we get thing kind of cleaned up back there we’ll let you come back.” So we went back there and then there was a moment Sid that I with her alone. And I was at the foot of her bed and I took my hands and I hit her feet and a said “Get up in the name of Jesus Christ.” And I felt the glory of God come all over me, all over me Sid and I looked at my mother’s face literally believing expecting for her to breathe and open her eyes but she didn’t. By that time my sister and some other people came into the room so that they could have their time with her I just moved and leaned on the wall I was disappointed, I felt defeated. Immediately the Holy Spirit spoke to me and said “I heard what you said but that’s not what I want to do.”
Sid: You know that is the last thing that I would have expected the Holy Spirit to say.
Sid: I’ll tell you what why don’t you just hold that thought right there. But how would you like to have supernatural understanding in every situation of your life? Three hundred times in the Bible it talks about understanding it tells us to get understanding. Give me one sentence understanding of the word understanding from the Biblical perspective.
Shane: “In all thy getting get understanding we get our understanding from God.” The clearest thing in the world is whatever you face in life there is an understanding that God has for it it doesn’t matter what it is. This is I believe the sentence I really really want people to grasp “Whatever God says is the understanding.”
Sid: You know that is so simple it’s deep (Laughing).
Sid: Now you’re going to discover power that you have to defeat every demonic foe you have in your life. You’re going to flow with an instant increase and accuracy in the spiritual gifts. Practical ways that you can obtain this revelation supernatural understanding from God in every situation how many times have you prayed “God I don’t understand this love one did everything they were supposed to do they’re young they shouldn’t have been taken!” Well I’m going to tell you something there is a force, that’s the word that comes from heaven to give you understanding in every circumstance of your life….find out what God meant when He talked to Shane be right back with Something More.
Sid: As many of you know I recently went to Israel and I was just… I was serious and I was kidding. I told several people “Wouldn’t it be something if when I’m in Israel when war broke out.” I went to Israel for Passover. You see my sister and brother in law recently made Aliyah, that means became citizens of Israel and are living in Israel right now. I wanted to visit them for Passover and I had several meetings that were going on. So I combined the whole thing and I went there I had a thought “Wouldn’t it be something if war broke out when I was there.” I actually thought it could happen and my wife Joyce went with me and I told Joy “I know that we’re going to be safe.” She was saying “Well I don’t want you really to go but I’m going to protect you.” Of course you know I’m thinking “How you going to protect me?” But she literally felt she was supposed to go protect me, to pray my way through.
I’m going to tell you something those of you who have followed what happened at the Passover massacre and the Passover war on Israel you know what’s going on when I was there and I needed that prayer support and that prayer protection. I mean it seemed like we would just leave the city and then a suicide bomber would do his thing. We were outside… on the Passover massacre we were in a huge traffic jam because it was right by when that massacre occurred. I can tell you as a fact there is supernatural protection when you do what God tells you do, when God tells you to do it you have nothing to fear, absolutely nothing to fear.
Some of you may recall the story of my sister and brother in law, they had a prophetic dream. My sister does not get a lot of prophetic dreams, is not one these people that God says this and God says that. So when my sister says God say this I really pay attention. I remember my sister saying “You know Sid I had a dream and in the dream my husband and I were determined on a certain set plan to stay in the United States because we had to get our retirement.” They both have very substantial retirements. In this dream they’re debating “Should I go? Should I not go? Because I need my money” and they decided “No we’re going to go” and it’s in the dream.
So they get on a jet and they’re heading making Aliyah to Israel and while they’re on the plane the voice of God comes to them, again this in the dream. The voice of God says “This was the last planes that Jews will be allowed to leave for Israel.”
Now needless to say after getting that dream they made Aliyah. They went to Israel they’re living in Israel today. Now many people ask “Sid do you believe it’s too late for a Jewish person to make Aliyah from America to Israel?” Absolutely not, but I believe that’s what God used to get my sister and brother in law to Israel. I believe prophetically this day will happen in America and prophetically I believe we’re very close to that day happening.
What would happen if the same thing happened in Argentina happened in America? I mean you have a house that’s worth $250, 000 and instantly it goes down 50% in value $125,000. You have $50,000 in your retirement plan or in the bank instantly it’s worth half, $25,000. Then each day the value keeps going down so you say “Well I’m going to go to the bank and take my money out! Take my retirement dollars out!” And the bank doors are closed you can’t get your money and you watch the dollar going down, down, down. That’s what’s going on in Argentina, and you say “It couldn’t happen in America,” it will happen in America, unfortunately.
So what should someone do? I believe a Jewish believer in the Messiah must hear from God. The safest place in the world is where God tells them to be, and a Jewish non-believer in the Messiah pack your bags quick and get to Israel. Why? Because time is running short and you have a choice you can go as a mensch, that’s a human being, or you can go with the clothing on your back as many of our brethren after the flesh in Germany did if they were blessed, if they were fortunate, if they didn’t go into the gas chambers.
By the way I believe a law will be passed in the United States shortly when economic chaos hits that we won’t be able to take money out this country. So while you can go as a mensch I urge you to.
Now a lot of people wonder about my sister and brother in law, I mean here they just made Aliyah they just moved to Israel and they don’t know the language, they’re in Ulpan, that’s where they’re studying the language. So people wonder “Here they just moved and they’re in a war zone. They were very comfortable in the United States. Are they sorry? Do they have regrets?” I can tell you my sister and brother in law, my sister’s almost 60 and my brother in law is over 60 and they’re studying Hebrew. My sister said to me when I was in Israel with her, she said “You know languages are very difficult for me but I love studying Hebrew. It’s God! The people that I meet, I love the people in Israel so much and I feel so safe in Israel. I just go down the street and I order a coffee afuf (I think that’s the way you say it. It’s coffee with cream in it).” And she said “I just the people of Israel, I love living in Israel. I’m not afraid of anything.”
Whether you’re Jewish or not the issue is whether Yeshua is your Lord. If He is your entitled to Psalm 91 “That no weapon formed against you shall prosper.” Not one weapon that’s formed against you. I’ve never seen the righteous forsaken of their seed begging for bread. I’m watching my sister experience that.
By the way we had a wonderful Passover Seder, Passover meal in Israel. It was just my family, Joyce and myself, and my sister and brother in law. And my sister said “You know I have a feeling I’m supposed to invite a particular Russian Jewish woman and she’s a single parent.” So my sister said “Would you like to come?” She said “Wonderful!” So this Russian Jewish Woman came and we had our Passover Seder. You see God has given us the culture of our faith and when we had the Passover meal this Jewish woman saw that Jesus, Yeshua, is in fact the Jewish Messiah. At the Passover Seder she became a Messianic Jew and she was so happy. The next Shabbat, the next Sabbath, she was in the Messianic Jewish congregation.
By the way, when Joyce and I were flying over to Israel, and interesting enough of course we didn’t know for sure we were going to be in a war zone, but we found ourselves in a war zone. Joyce was saying to me “You know I didn’t want you to go Sid but I felt I had to go to protect you, literally.” I believe her prayers did protect us while we were there.
But while I was on the airplane I heard for the very… actually the second time in my life. I was just dozing off and I heard an audible voice and the audible voice called my name. I mean it literally startled me so much I looked around and I said to Joyce “Did you call my name?” I literally said that to her because that’s how clear it was.
So when we got to Israel I’ve got some very interesting things to report to you. We had a couple of services one was at a Messianic congregation in Tel Aviv. The Messianic rabbi is David Lazerus and the night I went there to speak was a night that many of the young men and women were called into active duty. So a lot of the members of the congregation were very heavy and why were they heavy? Because their sons and daughters were going into a war zone. I have to be candid with you I have it in my heart there’s going to be so many miracles and my faith was so high was believing for all sorts of physical miracles. I normally always get words of knowledge, I didn’t get any words of knowledge. I said “Lord what’s going on?” Then I realized He wanted me to talk about fear and worry, and heaviness. God gave me a supernatural message I never shared this message before and at the end of the message there was a release of the Spirit of joy.
You know doctors tell us “Watch a comedy if you have cancer.” By laughing you release good things into your body that heal your body. How much more when you start laughing in the Spirit of God? How much more healing comes? Literally I believe people that are laughing in the Spirit of God are laughing at the devil and laughing at their problems because they know God has gone ahead and already removed their problems and already healed them.
My sister was at this service and she started laughing and laughing so loud. At first she was sitting in her chair and the next thing I noticed she was laying on 3 chairs and she said “You know Sid I didn’t have the nerve to do this but I felt like being like a little child. I felt like taking my legs and just kicking them up in the air like a little child being so free.” Remember the atmosphere before I started speaking? Do you remember the heaviness, the worry and the hurt, and the fear? It all was deflated it all disappeared.
I tell you God is so good I’m so glad I didn’t give the message that I had prepared. I had a wonderful message prepared but I would have missed God. That’s the purpose of life we must be led of God’s Spirit not by our peanut brain because our peanut brain doesn’t have all the information. But when we’re led by the Spirit of God we’re sons and daughters of the living God. There is nothing more exciting than being alive at this set time to favor Zion. At this time we’re in the footsteps, as the orthodox rabbis say, we’re are in the footsteps of the return of the Messiah, except they don’t say return I say return. They think it’s His first coming it’s actually His return and the two will be one, that’s my One New Man message.
Sid: My guest is Bible teacher Martha Kilpatrick and I’m interviewing her on her new book “Chariot of Fire – Elijah the Last Days.” I told you on the telephone when I called you Martha that there was something in your book that I didn’t know you had a burden for a supernatural burden for the Jew in Israel at the time. But there was something in your book that just it JUMPED OUT at me, and I believe it’s a now word for intercessors. You were talking about the distinguishing characteristics of people that are controlled in one or more areas of their life by a spirit of Jezebel, or a spirit of Ahab. You talked about the spirit of Ahab is “peace at any price.” I’m thinking “That’s what Israel is doing. That’s what…” I mean in Israel, and I happen to have dual-citizenship I’m an Israeli as well as an American. In Israel it’s like a small city mentality even though it’s a country. When one person so many people know that person, it’s national tragedy. With all the loss of life, even knowing the consequences of negotiating with the Palestinians, and the consequences are very simple; the Palestinians have made it clear that they want their own nation all of Israel not a Palestinian state the goal is all of Israel. You have to be crazy to want to have a peace agreement, that’s like putting the Trojan horse in your nation. But death after death of these young children, of these university students, and we say “Peace at any price,” and that’s what’s coming. Where did this spirit come from? It defies my logic. Explain this to me Martha.
Martha: Well you pointed out when you called me that it could be the spirit of Ahab and this astonished me because it’s so clear. I think I said to you certainly the terrorism appears to be very like Jezebel, threatening , intimidating, committing murder, and more religious than Israel claiming to be more religious all in the name of religion. All of those smack of the spirit of Jezebel and it astonished me. I think you asked me “How would you pray?”
Martha: I know from a personal walk in this that the first thing you need is courage from God. It takes a supernatural courage to face this.
Sid: So what if you don’t have this do you ask Him for it?
Martha: You ask Him for it. You ask Him for it. It takes courage to face yourself, it takes courage those who are coming after you in that spirit…
Sid: More of… Israel can’t pray for themselves…
Sid: … they can pray for peace, but how should someone that’s like you, and I’m looking at you you’re from a non-Jewish background but you have a Magen David, a star of David around your neck. You’re boldly saying “I’m on your side Israel. I love the Jewish people.” That’s what that is saying to me when you wear that around your neck. So how can someone like yourself pray effectively against, this is what it is, a spirit of Ahab. I mean listen that’s covenant land. God says “I’ve given it to Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob and your ancestors unconditionally forever, and don’t you dare give it up no matter what the circumstances.” Now even Israel, even the United States is orchestrating this whole deal. So how can we pray for America because I know, I don’t think this, I know that the day America plays the point man on a Palestinian state is the day it’s going to be the darkest day in the history of the United States of America, not Israel, but Israel is acquiescing it’s being an Ahab. They’re saying “Yes you can have a Palestinian just no more deaths of our children.”
Martha: Hmm. I think that our job as intercessors is to pray for that courage to face them. A salvation above all to recognize Yeshua as Messiah, that’s the answer. But in between here and there (chuckling), the spirit of fear is what comes that you acquiesce to Jezebel. I said in the book that to conquer fear is to conquer Jezebel. To be absolutely fearless…
Sid: Are most people fearful?
Martha: Most people are more fearful than they even realize, and able to be controlled through fear and threats. Jezebel increases your fear by those threats and the actual performance of some of those threats makes that principality seem indestructible and everyone of the lies of it.
Sid: Isn’t that exactly what the Palestinians are doing through suicide bombers?
Martha: It appears to be the max of it so clearly. So fearlessness by the courage of God is what is needed.
Sid: You know for our president, I can’t speak for him at this second but I can speak for him historically. He has been what is called politically centrist, he walks right down the middle he finds out what the majority of the people want and that’s what he does. As a centrist that’s pleasing man we have to pray for courage for our president…
Sid: …and to have the…
Sid: Yeah I mean with everything going on in the world today I think personally God put Sharon in office, I don’t believe it’s an accident. We needed a military type in Israel at this moment, but I also believe just as strong that God put Bush in office, he is God’s man of the hour. You know what he tells people when he sees them, just you know he’s in a big crowd and he shakes hands with people, I’ve had people tell me this and they say “Mr. President I’m a Christian and I’m praying for you.” This is what his answer is every time “Oh please I need that!” Can you imagine having a president like that. We’ve got to lift his hands up.
Martha: We have to pray.
Sid: Martha you told this story at our conference of what happened to you in Russia that really fits in right now.
Martha: We’d gone on a missionary trip there. A friend of mine, Carol and I were walking the streets of St. Petersburg praying. She took me by the arm and stopped me and she said something that it took me a long time to understand. She said “Martha where you walk Jezebel is displaced, Jezebel and Ahab are displaced.”
Sid: Oh will you walk all over my office Martha? (Laughing) No I’m just kidding, I’m not teasing but go ahead.
Martha: (Laughing) And she said “Because you have conquered it. Those who are after you and in yourself you have authority in the heavens over this principality.” I stood there a bit in shock but later I began to comprehend what she was saying. I believe that God’s going to use this book to prepare us to be instruments that can part the heavens.
Sid: Well it’s the anointing that’s on you is transferred to people that read this book because the anointing that is on you is almost like you coming into their home when they read this book.
Martha: It is my story and it is my journey.
Sid: You know as we’ve discussed all of this week most of this is blind spots this control, this fear, this just being so apathetic, just being self-centered, just wanting fun – fun – fun. Would you pray that the blind spots would be removed for our Mishpochah right now?
Martha: Yes, yes I will! Our precious Father in heaven we ask You to bring Your kingdom on earth. I ask you to bring it through the listeners, through me, through Sid, and ever listener. Grab us Father that we may be filled with forgiveness and filled with You Spirit that where we walk whether it’s in the prayer closet for Israel, or whether it’s on the streets on Jerusalem that we will displace the dominion of evil. The presence of Jezebel and Ahab intimidation will depart. Let us as believers be instruments by personal repentance and personal cleansing to bring forth the defeat of Satan’s plans for your nation. I ask it in the name of Yeshua. Praise you Lord I know you will do it!
Sid: Spirit of the living God I pray that you convict of sin and righteousness and judgment. Father God we’re Your best, we’re the only body you have on earth and we humbly say “Show us where we’ve yielded to the enemy so we can repent because I’m not satisfied, my Mishpochah are not satisfied with the intimacy that we have with you we need more and we know this is a stepping stone. Almighty God reveal by Your Spirit areas we need to repent of. In Yeshua’s name I pray. Mishpochah even the bad areas in our life that’s affected by Jezebel or by Ahab, God is even redeeming those things. Even though the devil meant it for evil God’s going to use it for good.
Sid: Hello Sid Roth here with Mark Virkler and Mark during the commercial break you told me about how you have learned supernaturally mediate on God’s word. Give me a scripture that you mediated on that literally was life changing to you.
Mark: Alright the scripture is that “We are transformed while we look not at things that are seen but things that are not seen.” And I thought really I thought that I was transformed by looking at the law of scripture which says “Thou shall not steal.” And setting my will to do it and that law was not in the unseen world that was in the seen world. And I set my will to do it and I try hard to not steal and I succeed some days and don’t other days. “So Lord what do You mean when you say I’m transformed by looking into the unseen world? What is in the unseen world that I would look at that would transform me?” And as I journaled about it that’s part of the book of meditation you would look at a book and you’d journal about it. Here’s what the Lord said to me “Mark whatever you fix your eyes on grows within you and whatever grows within you you become.” He said “I want you to fix your eyes on Jesus and I want you to see Him in the unseen world, I want you to see what He’s doing and I want your to say ‘Yes Lord’ to that and do that.” So if I’m angry and mad and I want to hit a person before I hit him I just look and see if Jesus is hitting that person and sure enough he’s not he’s got his arm around him and he’s loving him and he’s pouring some oil into him; “Mark heal this person’s heart.” And if I say yes Lord to that I’m transformed from a hitter to a lover because I looked into the unseen world and saw Jesus in action and I took that home. And before I knew enough to do that I used to look in all the wrong places I used to look at Bible law and that just made me a legalist. And sometime I would look at my sin and my weakness and that just made me depressed. And the Lord said “Mark I didn’t tell you to look at your sin or your weakness, I didn’t even tell you to live under the law.” He said “I told you to live by the Spirit and walk by the Spirit, and worship in the Spirit and pray in the Spirit, and if you did do that you’re not even under the law; not that the law goes away it’s a safety net underneath to catch me to catch me if I ever fall from the Spirit. But He said “You’re called to live by the Spirit to see what the Father’s doing to do what He’s doing and to live out of that.” So I’ve learned to keep my eyes fixed on Jesus whose at my right hand all of the time and He’s there with you and see what He’s doing tune to flow and let it come alive and live out of that vision that comes alive.
Sid: You know something that you just said is so profound but you didn’t say it God said it to you and that is “Whatever you fix your eyes on will grow within you.” So what about people that use television as a diversion and you can’t watch TV without having stuff slipped in that you don’t want to see. I mean I have to tell you I watch news and sports and I’m having trouble with both of them now. The news is so negative today that I end up talking about what’s going in current events rather than Jesus because I guess it grows within me.
Mark: That’s exactly right, the Bible says “Dwell on things which are lovely, just and pure and that surely doesn’t include the news because it’s dwelling on what’s negative. And one day when I was looking at Washington DC and feeling really depressed I said “Man what I see down there scares me to death because they don’t have moral integrity, they spend money out of control, they don’t honor the word of God.” And I was full of fear that they’re going to capsize the economy because the spend without any control, restraint and I was angry they had no morals. And I said “Well hold it Mark anger and fear are not gifts of the Holy Spirit” And so I said “Okay I’m going to do my morning devotions I said “Lord I think I need a new picture of Washington DC because the picture I’m looking at doesn’t contain you I just see evil and corruption, I don’t see Jesus” which means I’m looking at a picture which contains a lie because Jesus is everywhere. And so I said “Lord where are You in Washington DC?” And I mean I put a smile on my face and I tuned into pictures which is the way I get a vision and I flow in picture drifted into my mind of Jesus enthroned on the throne above Congress. And the White House with long flowing robe flowing down over Congress and the White House and His glory streaming down over Congress and the White House and He spoke a flowing thought to me which I journaled it up. He said “Mark I rule in Washington DC.” He said “I’m King of kings and I’m Lord of lords I rule.” Well that picture healed my anger, healed my fear, healed my pessimism because if I don’t see Jesus in action I’m as negative as can be. And one of the Rhema words the Lord spoke to me many years ago was that leadership; it automatically transferred to those that remained optimistic. And if I’m going to sit around with the doldrums’ I can’t be a leader for Christ. And we want to be leaders for Christ and so I need to get rid of pessimism God’s not pessimistic…
Sid: Well you just said such a mouthful I need you to say it again. What did God tell you about leadership?
Mark: Leadership is automatically transferred to those that remain optimistic.” And He spoke that to me on a day where I was still a pessimist. I was down in the mouth and drowning and it convicted my heart and man I’m so convinced. I mean God’s not pessimistic, He’s not down in the mouth; He’s absolutely convinced He rules the universe. And He would like His bride to believe that (Laughing). And I wasn’t taught that in my early Christian years.
Sid: Let’s zero back to the 4 keys that God showed you when you took a year to learn how to hear His voice.
Mark: Okay, so Habakkuk 2:1, 2 verse 1 was “Spirit of God spoke to me to go to your guidepost and become still.” The second thing was Habakkuk said “I’m going to keep watch to see what He’s going to speak to me.” And there’s 2 keys there the seeing one and the speaking one. And we’ve kind of defined the speaking one already as God voice sounds like flowing thoughts or spontaneous thoughts which means…
Sid: You know most people think that its sort of like Charlton Heston in “The Ten Commandments” with the booming voice and that’s where we get faked out a lot.
Mark: That’s where we get messed up because that’s not the way it comes 99½ % of the time to most of us. Alright I’ve had that experience once in my whole life and I’m 62 years of age so I normally hear His voice as spontaneous flowing thoughts. And so does everybody and if they honor that and step into that then they can hear God’s voice everyday all the time even in the supermarket. You’re checking out you can picture Jesus next to that lady there and you can say “Hey Lord what nice thing do you want to say to her?” I turn to flow and a flowing thought comes to you and you can share it with her and you’ve prophesied, give a word of wisdom, word of knowledge effortlessly right there in the supermarket.
Sid: Are you telling me that they’re many people that take this supernatural course; and it is supernatural it came from God and they never prophesied, they never had words of knowledge this starts?
Mark: Absolutely, absolutely I mean I talked to a woman last week in a seminar and she said “She heard my teaching several years ago and it opened up the entire gift of prophecy to her and that’s what she functions in right now.” And so yeah it opens up any and all of the gifts of the Holy Spirit because once you hear His voice His voice just flows out through each one of those gifts.
Sid: Okay that was the first key what was the second?
Mark: Alright “I will keep watch to see.” And I mean I asked the Lord what that was about and He said “Mark fix your eyes on Jesus.” He said “Pray the prayer that Paul prayed in Ephesians 1:17.” He said “I pray that the eyes of your heart would be enlightened.” And I said “Huh…I went through Bible college and I never prayed that prayer, I never even focused on the eyes of my heart; I don’t know anything about the eyes of my heart.” He said “You take the eyes of your heart and you fix them on Jesus.” And I said “Is it hard?” He said “It’s got to be simple enough for a child because you can’t enter the Kingdom unless you’re a child.” If you make any of this more difficult than a 7 year old can do it, and I have a 7 year old granddaughter who does this and journals and sends me her journaling by email. If you make it harder than that you’ve wrecked it okay. So to make sure I don’t make it hard I smile, when I’m there at my computer and my hands on the keyboard I put a smile on my face because then I’m not grunting and I’m not making it hard. I mean if Jesus can be laughing I can be laughing and it calms me down and I get out of own laboring and get into His rest and get a flow going. And you can’t get a flow going if you’re striving and grunting, so big smile on your face and picture Jesus right next to me and I define that as godly imagination. I define godly imagination as picturing things God says are so. So if God’s says “Jesus is Immanuel next to me” well then He’s here next to me. And there’s no reason in the world I can’t picture my theology if I can think it I can sure picture it. And if a picture’s worth a thousand words then I just intensified within me by a thousand fold the spiritual reality. Just like the father in faith when God gave him a picture of the stars in the heaven the next verse says “Then he believed,” Genesis 15:5, 6. So if I want heart faith, if I want faith that can cast mountains in the sea I need pictures from God; God’s not afraid to give pictures He gave… Jesus without a parable He taught them not. So I don’t need to fear picturing, I don’t need to fear Godly imagination, I need to define it and say “I can move into that.” So I’m going to quiet myself down, the easiest way to quiet myself down is to picture Jesus. If I’m picturing Jesus it calms my thoughts, focuses me in on Him and my brains not just empty it’s focused in the presence of Jesus. And I write down “Good morning Lord what do You want to say to me?” Put a smile on my face tune to flow which is a third key which is “His voice is flowing thoughts.” And then the 4th key “God said to Habakkuk “Inscribe the vision.” Just begin to write out the flow of ideas that come and that simple act of writing is we stay in that faith mode for 5 minutes or 10 minutes and write in faith. Because I know that when the flow is on I can go back and test it then which means I don’t have to test it now. If I can write for 5 or 10 minutes without testing it I can get 10 minutes of stuff.
Sid: Now when just out of curiosity when you’re writing for 5 or 10 minutes do you stop then for while and think “What am I going to write next?” Or do you just write without thinking this is what I’m trying to understand?
Mark: Yeah I write without thinking because thinking for me is Mark Virkler controlling my cognitive thoughts myself and linearly putting stuff together connecting with my the sins of the prophets just doing the connecting I don’t want that. I want to die daily, I want Christ to come alive I want to hear His voice. So connecting thinking is Mark Virkler’s thinking and flow…flowing thoughts come from the spirit realm. And if it’s flowing accusation, condemnation and lies it’s demonic. If it’s flowing comfort and faith and hope it’s coming from the Holy Ghost. So I only want one kind of flow the flow that lines up with the names of Jesus. I’ve got my eyes fixed on Jesus doing the flow and here’s one of the rules…yeah if the flow stops. I’m here typing and the flow stops instead of thinking I just go back and picture Jesus put a big smile on my face, picture Him very clearly again and say “Hey Lord is there more that You want to say to me?” And the smile on my face and my eyes fixed on Jesus the flow will bubble up again and I start typing again.
Sid: Now let me ask you this question. I’m Jewish coming from a Jewish background I was always told don’t make any image of God and I recognize I can picture Jesus but I think I have a little blockage because of that training from just being a child. And I don’t know in other words I don’t what Jesus to picture by that I mean is what is He look like; how do I picture Him? Do you understand my question?
Mark: I sure do and you know He’s got 100 names in the Bible which means He’s probably got 100 faces. Matthew, Mark, Luke and John preached and I was told different faces an eagle and ox, a man and a servant you know. And then you find those in the Book of Revelation if I’m from a totally black church I’ve seen Jesus as black, and if I’m white He’s usually white. And the color of His skin is not what I’m coming to it’s His character, it’s His nature.
Sid: Yes but you’re seeing an image when you visualize.
Mark: And when I first saw that image I saw Him from the shoulders on down, long flowing robes, gentle loving countenance reaching out to engulf me in reams of love that’s what I saw. And when I finally did see a face after a few weeks His eyes were sparkling full of laughter and a great big smile on His lips, that’s what I saw. And I’m not real concerned about the color of His skin, I believe He becomes all things to all people and that’s great. I think that He has more than one face, I think that we see through a veil darkly and so…
Sid: And so are you saying to me that when you visualize Jesus sometimes He…alright skin color I get but you’re saying even His facial characteristics are different on different times?
Mark: Well yeah He can be firm, yeah He can be firm if He needs to be and He’s not laughing necessarily and so it’s two lovers sharing love. So it’s just you and your wife together you know…
Sid: Okay but if I want to picture my wife in my imagination I have no difficulty doing that because I’ve seen her in the natural that’s what I’m trying to figure out.
Mark: When Jesus in the natural is somebody with two arms, two legs, somebody with a torso and long flowing robes for most of us sometimes He has sandals and that’s what I see. Some people see Him in wranglers and you can find; the actual color of His skin I don’t think it’s real crucial. Like Paul says “We see though a glass darkly.” And I think that any glimpse we get of Jesus it’s only a glimpse of one part of Him it’s not the fullness of Him because we’d probably melt down if we saw the fullness of Him. We’ve seen a little bit you know like the guy who saw an elephant and just saw a little bit and we’re just seeing a little bit and that’s fine. I mean it’s His word, we’re coming to the Wonderful Counselor to receive wonderful council to have our hearts healed up of fear and anger and frustration. It’s the words He’s speaks, it’s His arms around us that hold us, it’s His touch as we feel His touch and our cells are energized that’s where we’re coming to not the color of our skin.
Sid: Okay now tell me just a little bit more about this journaling.
Mark: Yeah, I didn’t think journaling was going to help me at all because I don’t like writing and I’m not very good at spelling and grammar and I thought it would mess it up big time, but if you look in the Bible if you look at David He wrote a 150 Psalms and John wrote 22 chapters of 2 visions in Revelation. Well these are men and so I tried it and instead of it crushing my prayer time it released it. And I asked God “Why did journaling release my prayer time and let me hear Your voice for 10 or 15 minutes? And He said “Mark before we began to journal as soon as I began speaking and give you a thought you would instantly test it and say ‘Hmm wonder if that came from God?’ You’d jam the receiver, hang up on Me and I can’t get more than 2 words out of My mouth but with journaling you stay in faith for 5 minutes and you write in flow for 5 minutes and I can talk to you for 5 full minutes because you know you can test it after the flow is done and make sure it lines up with scripture, but then you’re not jamming the receiver and hanging up on me because you allowed Me to speak for 5 minutes without doubting Me.” Because if I’m going to shift from faith to doubt I jam the receiver and hang up on God because those who come to God must come in faith. So journaling lets me stay in faith for 5 minutes or 10 minutes and receive 5 minutes of Him talking to me.
Sid: …Mark last thought.
Mark: Well I just like to say I just pray for the scales to fall from people’s eyes and blindness to be gone and for them to see clearly into the spirit realm and to hear clearly the voice of the Lord Jesus. I speak that to you in Jesus name Amen.