Sid: I just recently got such encouragement it’s almost like at times I feel like I’m a voice calling in the wilderness and wondering is anyone getting it, is anyone out there beginning to understand God’s plan for the next move of God’s Spirit. See I was involved in a move of God’s Spirit; I came to be a believer at the end of the Charismatic movement as a Jewish person that Jesus walked into my bedroom and He became real to me. I was one of the pioneers in what became known as the Messianic Judaism; I know what it is to fight for a vision, but I see something bigger, something greater, something that’s about ready to happen that doesn’t make any of the former moves wrong, they are right, they are of God. There is something bigger that is coming, and some of the missing blanks to my questions have been filled in by my guest. I have him on the telephone; I’m speaking to him at his office in his church, Glory of Zion Outreach Center in Denton, Texas, Pastor Robert Heidler. Robert it was an interesting God coincidence that I got to meet you, at least by telephone; that is a mutual friends the Schneier’s who have a Messianic Congregation in Odessa, Ukraine; told me about an unpublished manuscript and the more they told me about it the more I said “Can I borrow it?” They lent it to me; I devoured it and got you on the phone, and I said “We have got to get this to our Mishpochah.” You have a picture from your studies, and I might add, you have a Master’s in theology, from Dallas Theological Seminary. You have a scenario from your study of the scriptures and history of what the first church was like. Many times I wondered this, what happens when a thousand, two-thousand, three-thousand Jewish people that don’t even have a copy of the New Testament are struck with the reality of Jesus, and believe there can’t be much organization; there’s certainly aren’t church buildings; what was the first church like? If we can grasp what that first church was like maybe we can get some of the power that’s been missing for too long.
Robert: Amen, amen. You know when I began to study the early church and really began to read what was written about it at the time. It was a revelation because it was unlike anything we have ever seen or even imagined. So many people today think of the early church, you know, the day after Pentecost Peter went out and rented a building and put a steeple on top, and put up a sign that said “First Baptist Church of Jerusalem.” We don’t stop to think what the early church really was because most of the things we think of as church, would not be invented for another thousand years; yet they had a life and a power that the church today has not even imagined.
Sid: Paint me a picture from the best of your research of what the first church looked like.
Robert: Well I think there was several things that would characterize the early church. One was, it was a church overflowing with joy; I mean they met in homes, they met in the temple courts, they met in out in the fields. Basically, the meeting place was not significant; they just met wherever they could. There gatherings were filled with joyful singing and dancing. One of my favorite quotes about the worship of the early church comes from Clement of Alexandria about 250 A.D.; he described their worship this worship this way “The daughters of God lead in a ring dance; the righteous are the dancers; the music is a song of the King of the universe; the maidens strike the lyre; the angles praise; the prophets speak; the sound of music issues forth; they run in pursuit of the jubilant band; those that are called make haste eagerly desiring to receive the Father.” So it’s just a picture of just an overflowing joyful celebration in the presence of God.
Sid: When he spoke about dancing in a circle, the first thing that came to mind is the Israeli dances, the Hora etcetera, they are all circle dances.
Robert: Yeah that was very typical of the early church. They would begin by doing those circle dances. We picture the angles around the throne of God in heaven; in Revelation 4:5 we picture them all standing there, in the early church they picture them all doing ring dances around the throne. So when they got together they would join in with the ring dances of the angels.
Sid: That’s interesting because some of my friends that have the gift of discernment that can see angels, they say when they go into services and they see people dancing they see angles all around the people dancing. Dancing the exact same way that they are, which almost like this quote you had from Clement.
Robert: Yeah. It’s such a different picture of church than most Christians today have because most Christians think of the early church as sad and somber; it really was not. You read the quotes and joyful celebration dancing… St. Basil in the fourth century said “Could there be anything more blessed than to imitate on the earth the ring dance of the angels.”
Sid: Okay, let’s suppose you’re going to visit, and according to your manuscript these were house churches. So you go to a house church, tell me what you see with your eyes as you’re entering.
Robert: Well I think as you come in, if we were to walk into a house church back in the late first century, it would look like there’s a party going on. People are just rejoicing, they’re dancing, they’re celebrating, and after a time of praise and worship the presence of God comes into the meeting. At some point they’ll bring out food and they’ll eat together, it’s a big family celebration.
Sid: You know I was telling you that I’ve just started One New Man Shabbat celebrations. What you’ve just said has triggered me now because there was a presence of God from the very beginning of the last one we had of our Shabbat celebration. There was point where all of a sudden there was a release of God’s glory and healings broke out like popcorn.
Robert: That’s what you see in the early church. It talks about in the early writings, and even in the New Testament that the presence of God would come down… when they came together they formed a temple and the glory of God came tangibly down in the midst and the result was an outflow of the miraculous. Irenaeus wrote about 195, and he said that “When they got together it’s very common for prophetic words, tongues, miracles of healing,” and then he added “The church frequently saw people raised from the dead by the prayers of the saints.” That’s sort of an exciting church to be in.
Sid: Yeah tell me where they meet and I’ll be there! By the way, when did they meet, the first church?
Robert: Well it’s interesting, first of all they met a lot of times in places, but they had their weekly reunion usually in the first century at least, on Saturday night. It was really sort of a picture, I think, of the Friday night Shabbat where they were used to meeting together in homes for Shabbat, and they would sing and eat together, and praise and worship God, as part of their Jewish background. So on Saturday night, which really began the first day of the week, they would meet back together in small groups and do the same thing in celebrations of Yeshua.
Sid: So to understand the Shabbat dinner in a home on a Friday night, in a Jewish home, would give us insight as to what they naturally did in the first church.
Robert: Exactly. It’s interesting down to details, like if you read early writings there was a special prayer, or a special song that was sung at the beginning when the church came together; it was a special song or prayer as they lit the lamps. Just as Shabbat was welcomed, when the mother of the house would light the Shabbat candles, so they would welcome the presence of the Lord with a special prayer to light the lamps at the start of the church service. So in detail, I think they learned how to worship together as a church through the Friday night Shabbat times.
Sid: This is Sid and I’m speaking to Pastor Robert Heidler about his unpublished manuscript.
Sid: My guest by way of telephone at his home in Columbus, Ohio is Rabbi Kirt Schneider; Rabbi Schneider is Rabbi over Adat Adonai Messianic Jewish Congregation in Toledo, Ohio. He also teaches Jewish root and evangelism to the church with his ministry Shalom Ministries. On yesterday’s broadcast we found out that Kirt was raised in a Jewish home; both parents Jewish; was Bar Mitzvah’d in a conservative synagogue but like many Jewish people of his generation did not know the scriptures. His understanding of a Christian was someone that wore – he had one friend because all of his other friends were Jewish, wore a big cross around his neck. But that cross had zero to do with intimacy with God through Jesus, it just was a fashion statement. Kirt’s god became wrestling, his whole identity was wrapped up in wrestling. Is it true that you went down to almost nothing in weight so that you could perhaps you felt you could become a champion by being at that low weight? It sounds like you were almost emaciated.
Kirt: Well, it’s true – it’s true and looking back on it I mean it was perhaps a mistake. The idea of you know if you can get down to a lower weight you’ll be wresting smaller guys but of course you forget a little bit that when you’re that low you’ll be as small as they are. So I did I was basically all skin and bone and muscle to begin with.
Sid: And you also did this with visualization, you would see yourself winning and even to the point of getting goose bumps you told me yesterday.
Kirt: That’s true I’d lay on my bed at night and envision myself with my hand raised as State Champ and chills would go through my body; this went on for years.
Sid: So did you become the State Champ?
Kirt: No I didn’t I was a very good wrestler I got to the place where there wasn’t anybody that I felt I couldn’t beat. I did get a small scholarship to wrestle in college, but here’s the thing, when I walked off the wrestling mat after wrestling my last match in high school even though I had a partial scholarship to college when I walked off that wrestling mat Sid in high school it was like the world was pulled out from under my feet after I wrestled that last match. Because suddenly I realized that I was moving into a world that was a lot bigger than people that wrestled at 119 pounds. You see for years the only world that I lived in were people that wrestled my weight class and I felt in control in that environment and feeling in control I felt the sense of peace, I had an identity, it was just a good feeling but when I walked off that mat for the last time in high school I realized that you know what I had been living in an illusion; that the world that I was moving into was much more complex it was made up of many more people than people that wrestled 119 pounds. And in an instant Sid it was like I went from feeling on top of the world and in control of life to suddenly in a twinkling of an eye feeling as if I was out of control, insignificant without purpose and without identity it was a terrifying experience. I didn’t know during those years that there was a devil, because being raised in a Jewish home we just never talked about the devil. No one had told me about him but I’ll tell you what during those two years of struggle between the time that wrestling ended in high school, and the time that Yeshua revealed Himself to me at 20 years old I literally felt Satan on me, literally feeling him taking possession of me, laughing at me and making me laugh at myself with his own laughter. Totally destroying me, the Bible says “That he came to steal, and kill and destroy,” and if the Lord would not have come to me at 20 years old supernaturally in a vision in the night and reveal himself to me Sid I would have been absolutely destroyed by Satan.
Sid: Well you know that there’s a lot of your background that is similar to mine; for instance your god was wresting, my god was money.
Sid: And my desire was to become a millionaire by age 30, so you went from wresting to wanting make money but that didn’t work out too well for you did it.
Kirt: It really didn’t and I knew personally that money wasn’t my answer because I come from a fairly wealthy background and I had seen the people in my neighborhood that they had problems just like everybody else. But I didn’t know what else to do so grasping for straws I thought maybe if I made a lot of money it will help to make me feel better. And it as during that time that Yeshua revealed Himself to me.
Sid: Well, you actually dabbled a little as I did as many Jewish people do in the New Age.
Kirt: That’s true I went down to California seeking out one of the shrines, one of the Yogi’s there Par Mongeo Condo and in fact it was while I was reading a book about middle eastern religion an autobiography of Yogi by Par Mongeo Condo that Yeshua appeared to me in the middle of the night.
Sid: Tell me about that night; that was back in 1978 you were 20 years of age; tell me what you remember about that night.
Kirt: Well, a little background I had dropped out of college, I was selling encyclopedias door to door for the purpose of making enough money to travel the country to find a location for a discotheque I wanted to open and it’s a long story.
Sid: What is it about us Jewish people I wanted to do all that too but go ahead.
Sid: Actually I did but go ahead. (Laughing)
Kirt: Long story short I’m promoted to a sales manager in this company and I get to a sales managers meeting one day we’re waiting for the other managers to arrive and this guy tells me about this book he’s reading the autobiography of a Yogi. I purchase the book, I’m reading the book, I’m devouring the book; there’s pictures in there Sid of this guy levitating off the ground supposedly. So I said “God,” I always had a faith in God I said “God if this is real if this guy can really levitate off the ground I said then this is a higher reality than making money.” And I thought to myself Sid and think how good I’d feel levitating off the ground, so I became like my new…I became so focused on this. And one night in the middle of reading this book I came home and I went to sleep I had a terrible headache this night, I wasn’t drunk, I wasn’t on drugs I just remember this night I had a terrible, terrible headache. I went to sleep, once again I want to make the point no one had ever witnessed to me, no one had ever told me about Jesus, I had no exposure to Yeshua whatsoever, but at 20 years old in 1978 at 3:30 in the morning as I slept in my bedroom at 3217 Bremerton Road in Pepper Pike, Ohio. The Lord awoken me from my sleep. My eyes were still closed but suddenly I was aware that I wasn’t sleeping it was a state of conscience awareness. And in that state Sid it lasted no more than 2 or 3 seconds it as if I was transported into another dimension; suddenly it was like I was being transported to a tunnel almost and suddenly Jesus appeared on the cross, it was in color, I could see the terrain; I could see people in the distance. I read later in the book of Luke chapter 23 of verse 49 “That the disciples looked on Him at a distance.” I believe the Lord supernaturally Sid, transported me in a vision in a vision of the night in a dream to see the site of the crucifixion. And as I was observing this a ray of red light from straight through the sky beamed down on Jesus’ head. When I saw the ray of light Sid from straight through the sky beam down on his head I knew that it was coming from God since it was coming from straight above. And I knew that God was telling me that somehow I was connected with this Jesus. Even though no one had ever witnessed to me as an American I knew enough to at least know that the person on the cross was Jesus.
Sid: Yeah, but didn’t you know that we Jews don’t believe in Jesus or that’s what we’ve been told?
Kirt: Well, I did but the thing is that to me it was just like kind of nonissue in my home, I mean I had no idea what I was about to encounter when I told my parents that I believed in Jesus. Because like I said I mean I just; we never talked about him one way or the other I mean I knew I was a Jew and Jews didn’t believe in Jesus but it never really dawned on me what the outcome of this…
Sid: So they were they excited as you?
Kirt: I thought they would be because I was so excited and you know I ran up to my Dad after I eventually got a New Testament and I said “Dad look at this verse here.” You know I was so excited I thought he would see how excited Jesus really was. Well they hired Sid one of the most famous deprogrammer in the country to kidnap me and deprogram me. His name was Ted Patrick, he’s been on major television shows and…
Sid: Yeah, I know I’ve read about Mr. Patrick. Why would you parents send you to such a high level programmer like that?
Kirt: I think that they were very embarrassed, I think that it would have been equivalent to me being thrown in jail. Here I was their Jewish son walking around their Jewish neighborhood telling all the neighbors about Jesus. I think they were absolutely just completely befuddled they had no idea what they could do.
Sid: Were you tricked into seeing him?
Kirt: I was. My dad said to me “We are going to talk to somebody about purchasing a restaurant.” And we drove to a hotel in Cleveland and I thought we were going to be speaking to somebody about a restaurant deal and we walk into the hotel room and my mom, dad and I walk in. There’s three people in the room a short distinguished looking guy in a three piece suit, two other guy of over 6′ both of them over 200 lbs. The door closes behind me once we’re all in the room and the short distinguish Ted Patrick says to me “We’re going to talk about cults, and then they flipped on the projector and started showing me the film of the Hari Krishna and they pointed to a little kid in the film a three or four year old. And they said “See that kid there’s nothing we can do for that kid, all that kid has ever known is the Hari Krishna but you have been living like a normal person for twenty years and we’re going to snap you out of this thing. I consider it a personal challenge,” and I sat up and I said “Listen I said I’m not programed, I said that I just believe that Jesus is the Yeshua the Messiah.” He said “Then you got nothing to worry about.” And I said “Well, can I leave” and one of the big goons said sit down.” And from there it was very clear I wasn’t getting out of the room, I asked permission to go to the bathroom in the room. Got on my knees and said “Lord please keep me.”
Sid: And now was your father in the room the whole time?
Kirt: Yes, yes he was in the room the whole time.
Sid: Didn’t you just appeal to him and say “Dad get me out of here?”
Kirt: No, it didn’t even occur to me because I knew that that wasn’t going to happen. But you know what I wasn’t scared and the bottom line was that it wasn’t an intense experience. What happened was a little bit after that they said “We’re going to take you to our rehabilitation home in California you’re going to live there and you’re going to snap out of this thing. But the reality was one of the big goons, I don’t know what other terminology to use he did not leave my side, he came back with me to my home in Pepper Pike, Ohio that night so that I couldn’t run away. The next day we got in my van and we drove to California to the rehabilitation house. The rehabilitation house was run by this big partier that actually was his son that really was just… and they whole they didn’t do anything and all they did was take me to the beach in the days and…
Sid: I’ll tell you what, hold that thought we’re just about out of time we’re pick up here on tomorrows broadcast.
Sid: I’ve got a couple that are red hot for the Messiah, Anita and David Duggan. We found out over the last couple of days Anita is raised in a nice Conservative Jewish home in Miami, Florida. Had a great love for God, but circumstances made her a drug addict. She got involved in dealing drugs, she was involved in the largest drug bust of the state of Mississippi; she had 3.75 million dollars’ worth of marijuana; Rolling Stones Magazine wrote her up; make a long story short drug lords in Columbia wanted to murder her, but she got out of that deal because they decided that it was such a big drug bust they would move it from the state level to the federal level, in the mean time she had a supernatural deliverance in an auto accident; saw the reality of God, gave her heart to Jesus, set free from drugs is married to a young man that is running a house Bible study, Bible church. So now you’re married, but you’re re-arrested now on federal charges. What happened next Anita?
Anita: Well I had my first supernatural experience when they put me in the patrol car to take me to Jackson, Mississippi. I was sitting in the backseat of the car, there was a DEA agent, and an officer driving me to Jackson. I think it was about an hour and a half drive. David, it was the first time we were separated, he was behind me in a car following. They started interrogating me to find out where my partner was. The Lord lifted me out of the car in the Spirit and I was flying above them the entire time.
Sid: So how did you answer their questions?
Anita: I never answered.
Sid: So what happened?
Anita: I just sat back… it was like I was taken out of myself it was like there was this body just sitting in the backseat of the car that never answered them the whole way. God protected me.
Sid: Because you would have said something that would have incriminated yourself and others.
Sid: Dave what did you observe when she was literally supernaturally lifted out of her body?
David: I had no idea that was happening Sid. It looked completely normal to me. I could see her sitting in the backseat, I could see the officers and the agents. I was just traveling with and praying for her because I knew it was a very stressful situation.
Sid: Anita, you were involved in drugs and you got supernaturally delivered by the Lord, but did you have any experiences remotely similar to this when you were into drugs?
Anita: No, none. I knew absolutely nothing about spiritual stuff at all.
Sid: Now when your wife got out of the car, what did you see David?
David: Well I could just see that she was very much at peace, in herself. She was trying to communicate to me in unspoken language and to some degree with spoken language this amazing out of body experience that she had had driving up to the State Capital of Mississippi.
Sid: Okay, so you have the trial, and I understand Anita you were really standing on scripture during this trial because what were you facing, how bad could it have been?
Anita: I was facing 15 years.
Sid: Huh you really don’t need that.
Sid: So you’re standing on God’s scriptures and what happens?
Anita: Well first of all I was trying to trust God, and I was not really really strong in it at first. I was scared and I was being torn by my lawyers trying to tell me “Just don’t confess just stay with us. Don’t say anything we’re gonna get you out of this.” But the Lord had given me a scripture in the very beginning it was Psalm 17:2-3. It had to do with if I would confess my sin before man He would publically vindicate me. I kept holding on to that every time I got weak, every time I felt like it’s not going to happen; I just kept holding onto the scripture. When I was Sid, David would be praying over me, he would sing over me, he would read me Psalms, he would try to encourage me and tell me “Anita you have to tell the truth, you have to tell the truth.”
Sid: So what happened?
Anita: Well we got a new lawyer and this lawyer was from Mississippi, and he finally said “We are going to have to tell the truth.” I mean they had actual surveillance photographs of me taking bales of marijuana out of a speedboat and loading it onto a truck. I mean they had pictures they had the truth, so there was nothing I could do but throw myself on the mercy of the court. Sid it was really an amazing thing; I didn’t even tell the attorney about this scripture and he wound up getting in front of the judge saying “Your honor, I throw my client to the mercy of this court. She has embraced Christianity to the fullest; she has married a young man who loves God. She has totally cut herself off from all these people. Please your honor let her go.” So he literally spoke out what the scripture God gave me.
Sid: During while this hearing was going on, you were almost embraced in a cloud of God’s glory, explain that.
Anita: The entire time this was going on the Lord protected me, He really did. I had no idea that the other people who were arrested they were either aliases, who were murderers who wanted by the law. I had no idea that God had enveloped me in a cloud of protection so that my life would be spared through this whole thing. Because at the very end they all went to prison, I was the only one who was set free.
Sid: No prison at all?
Sid: How come?
Anita: God vindicated me.
Sid: Okay, now you must be on literally in the clouds when… David your wife was facing 15 years of hard time in prison. Tell me what went on inside of you when you saw that she was set free with no prison time.
David: Well obviously I was thrilled Sid, but God had given me a measure of faith that I knew from the beginning that she would not serve time in prison. We married prior to the resolution of this court case. I was… looking at it in the natural I was taking the risk that I was marrying this woman and within months she could have been incarcerated for up to 15 years, but I knew by the Spirit of God that still small voice, that whispering, that she would not serve time in prison. So I was thrilled that it was confirmed in the natural what God had told us by His word, and by His Spirit.
Sid: So everything’s going good. You now are a youth pastor and someone offended you, and one thing led to another and you became, it’s hard to believe with everything that went on previously, you became an alcoholic for some 13 years. How did you come back to the Lord?
David: Well it was a very dark period in my life Sid, and I am not proud of it, but I love God more deeply today than I ever have because of His patience, and because of His continuing faithfulness to me throughout that entire period. At the end of that period, our daughter, gave birth to our first grandchild a precious little girl, her name is Catherine Ann. There are really two components that brought me out of that dark period in my life. The first was Anita’s love for me and her commitment to me.
Sid: Why did you stick with him? I mean now your husband is an alcoholic and you’re totally right with God. Why did you stick with him?
Anita: I stuck with him because I had a promise from God supernaturally that He was going to give me back the man that I fell in love with. The man I fell in love with was a man who ran after God’s heart.
Sid: Yeah but that’s a long time 13 years, how did you stick with him 13 years?
Anita: I had faith, I knew that someday Sid he’d come back, and I was not gonna miss out on that.
Sid: And one day David your granddaughter did something that shocked you.
David: She was just an infant only a few months old, and I was up at my son in law and my daughter’s home and I was helping them kind of facelift their home. Painting rooms, getting the nursery ready, and so forth; as was the custom at the time I was drinking, and I was drinking heavily, and I went over to my granddaughter, who was probably 2 months or maybe 3 months old in that drunken state. I could see her even at that tiny little age recoil from me, she was fearful there was something emanating from me that scared her, and that was unacceptable to me. I was not willing to trade the love of my grandchild for drunkenness.
Sid: And what happened with you recommitment to the Lord, and your alcohol problem?
David: Well in one day’s time God delivered me from that addiction. I mean I was a very very heavy drinker for a long time, and on the day I determined with my own will that I was returning to God, I just began to experience sovereign deliverance from these dark spiritual powers that feed that addiction.
Sid: Listen God is so good Mishpochah, not only were they both set free, wait till you hear the ministry God has placed them in.
Sid: If you were listening on yesterday’s broadcast I have Paul and Luanne Wilbur here. Paul is an Integrity Music recording artist, and we’re featuring his latest, and I might add I believe his most anointed CD. It was recorded live at John Hagee’s church; it’s called “The Watchman.” Paul on yesterday’s broadcast you were talking about the return of the Lord. I was kidding you as anyone would have of been “Well no one knows!” You said “Yes but there’s a missing piece of a puzzle.” What did you mean by that?
Paul: There’s a tapestry if you will that God has woven together over the last two millennia that gives us insight and understanding of the things He said in the past. Yeshua was asked many times “What’s going to be the sign of Your coming?” Listen Sid one of the anointing’s of a watchman is they watch for the coming of the Lord. There are three things, three main anointing’s that a watchman does.
- They watch for the dawn – There’s all kind of stuff in there we can’t even go into.
- They watch for danger and they sound the alarm – One of their main jobs is they watch for the coming of the Lord, and they call to the gatekeeper “Open the gate so that the Lord can come in.” Yeshua spoke about that in John 10 as well.
But there is a piece of the puzzle that since the recording of this watchman thing it’s like the spirit of the watchman has come on my life in a way that I’ve never known.
Sid: As you’re sharing this I am starting to travail deep within. Luanne I’m just curious is anything going on with you spiritually as he’s sharing about the watchman?
Luanne: Well just a real excitement and a churning, churning…
Sid: Alright, but what is this travail? As you’re talking about the anointing of the watchman I am travailing deep within my spirit, but go ahead.
Paul: In Matthew 23 Yeshua gives a piece of the puzzle which has now come into focus. He said “You will not see me again until you say.” Now over the last many years people have said “He’s speaking to Israel. No He’s speaking particularly to Jewish people. No He’s speaking particularly to Jerusalem because He says ‘Jerusalem, Jerusalem’” in Matthew 23 37th verse and following the next two verses. “Oh Jerusalem Jerusalem you who killed the prophets stone those who are sent to you! How often I wanted to gather your children together as a hen gathers her chicks, but you were not willing. You will not see me again until you say ‘Blessed is He (Baruch haba b’shem Adonai).’ What a thrill Sid…
Sid: Blessed is He who comes in the
Sid and Paul: name of the Lord.
Paul: I got to lead that song in Jerusalem 10 years ago on that marvelous… these times of the Lord that He gives to us that, now that I look back I see how precious that really was. A lot of times we can be walking at the time in the anointing in the season of the Lord for our lives and not even know it. We’re so caught up with the details, or what’s happening, or what’s not happening, or how should I be responding here. That we don’t see the things, and that’s exactly what was happening to the people of Jerusalem when He spoke these words. Now listen, here’s the hidden thing. He said “You will not see me again.” Now who’s He speaking to? Was He speaking to all of Israel? Are we waiting for all of Israel to say to Yeshua “Blessed is He who comes in the name of the Lord?” I don’t think so, although…
Sid: Many people believe that.
Paul: Many people believe that, and it wasn’t until 1948 that was even possible; which is a supernatural happening. Can a nation be born in a day? Yes says the Spirit of the Lord. As He spoke to the prophet “Son of man can these dry bones live?” when Ezekiel was standing there seeing that. Yes they can. There standing as a might army today. Was He speaking particularly to Jerusalem? Well there was no united Jerusalem until 1967, so that’s possible. This is so, so wonderful to me that God has held back these things until this last hour. Who was He speaking to in particular? He said “I wanted to gather your children together as a hen gathers her chicks.” Who were the hens of Jerusalem? Who are the ones who sat in judgment over Him just a couple of days after He spoke these words? Who was it that handed Him over, had the authority to hand Him over who were the hens that oversaw the chicks? Was it not the Sanhedrin? Was it not the Pharisees, and the Sadducees, the rulers, the 71 elders who ruled over Israel of their doctrine, of their chala-chab, their day to day walking out of the word of God? Wasn’t it them? He said “I wanted to gather the chicks, but YOU HENS weren’t willing!” He said “You will not see me again until YOU say.” For 300 years after the time Yeshua that spoke these words the Sanhedrin continued not in Israel, not in Jerusalem, but outside as they codified what we know as rabbinic Judaism today, and disappeared for 1700 years as a ruling body. On December 10th, put your seatbelt on, on December 10, 2004 71 elders approached the Knesset in Jerusalem and asked for permission to pray on top of the Temple Mount, and they said “We are the Sanhedrin revived.” “You will not see me again Jerusalem until you, who, until the leaders, until the rulers, until those 71 elders look to Him and say ‘Blessed is He who comes in the name of the Lord.’” Until 1948 no Israel, until 1967 no Jerusalem, and until 2004 no leaders of the people to stand in the gap and to declare to Yeshua, “Blessed is He who comes in the name of the Lord.” We are… the pieces are in place, we are in the season of the return of the Lord.
Sid: I’m looking at your new CD entitled “The Watchman” and there’s a picture of religious Jew, you might even call him a Sanhedrin with a tallit, a prayer shawl, over his head. The album is called “The Watchman” but there’s one song in particular called “Adonai” tell me about it.
Paul: Yeshua says “You call me Lord Lord and do not do what I say.” Sid we’re in a time now when those who call on Him as Lord are gonna lay down what they think, and take up what He thinks. They are gonna do the commandments of the Lord. The law of the Lord is not a bad word, the Torah, the walking out of the precepts of the concept. These are not just the suggestions of God, these are His laws that cause us to come into harmony with His plan, into harmony with His decrees, with His creation, with His kingdom. We need to be law keepers. In fact, I say that if the word of God is not been inscribed upon our hearts, Jeremiah 31:31, we are not New Covenant believers. We need the law of the Lord inscribed on our hearts that we are law keepers, we are keepers of the things of God; in fact, did you know Israeli’s today don’t call Christians heretics they call Christians “notsrim” which means watchman. There are two main words for the word watchman Sid in Hebrew.
- Notsair – this word, where we get the plural notsrim, is a watchmen in the sense of one who guards a precious treasure.
Even secular Israeli’s know those who follow Yeshua have been called to be watchmen, to guard a precious treasure, a covenant keeper, one who watches over the word and the ways of God to walk in them. The watchmen, Adonai, we call to you Yeshua you are Lord of all. We say not my will, but Your will be done. You are Lord, You are Adonai.
Excerpt Adonai – The Watchman
Sid: Can you imagine Paul that brand new installed Sanhedrin, that leadership of Israel first time in almost 2000 years that has been installed and operational is about ready to say what you were singing “Baruch haba b’shem Adonai (Blessed is He who comes in the name of the Lord).”
Paul: They are, they are preparing Sid to declare it. It is time to stop playing games; it’s time to get off the fence. For those of you who are listening to us today and you’d say “You know I have prayed a prayer, but I have not been walking the walk.” Now is the time; pull your car off to the side of the road, put your work down at your desk, do whatever you need to do and say this with me. “Yeshua, I declare you are Lord of all. I want to walk in Your ways, in Your word, in Your plan, come and fill me fresh new with Your Spirit right now. I surrender my heart and my life I give it to you. Come Yeshua, come and use me.
Sid: My guest by way of telephone is Eddie James he doesn’t need an introduction to most of you; he’s had the number 3 song on all charts. I want you to get to know Eddie James and what God has done in his life. You’re a young guy Eddie and at age 8 you get saved and this is unfair, I protest you heard the audible voice of God; what did He say?
Eddie: (Laughing) I heard the voice of the Lord begin to speak to me about my purpose; immediately after I said “Yes” to God. I’ll never forget it the Lord said, “You will preach my word to the nations; you will lift up a sound of worship. You will sing, you will write music.” I just heard it just like that. And I’ll never forget just the encounter and the weightiness of the moment. I told my father as soon as I got in the car with him at home and shared that with him. The first thing he said was “You tell your mother.” And when I told my mother that when she had finally got home from service that day she pulled out this card that she had written on; there was a man that came from Africa to my church while I was in my mother’s womb and told her almost word for word that same thing that I had just shared with her. She had never shared with anyone except my father.
Sid: She must have been beside herself I mean someone that young is not supposed to hear clearly from God, well though I guess you could go back to Samuel, so there’s a little precedent. But you learned the supernatural, the reality of the living God as a child; tell me a few of the things that you saw with your eyes with your mother’s faith. Because you didn’t have much in the way of finances and therefore your mother was in the position that most people in the next year or two years are going to find themselves in. That is totally dependent on God, what did you see as a child?
Eddie: It’s fascinating, I just remember I come from a very prayerful heritage my aunts, my uncles, my grandparents they were prayer leaders, as well as worship leaders of our church I grew up in The Church of Christ there in Phoenix, Arizona called Immanuel. And it was constant that I heard the intercession in our home so in that context there was a season of my life where financially it was pretty challenging. We were going through a rough time financially. So there were times when my brothers or my sister would have fevers, catch cold, or get sick or have very challenging health issues. My mother just would use anointing oil and lay hands on them because going to the hospital wasn’t an option we just did not have the finances or the medical insurance support to take care of those. But my mother would lay hands on my brother Terrance I’ll never forget he was really really sick. Not physically moving having some real bad health issues and my mother laid hands on him and prayed and just…I remember breaking the spirit of death off of my brother, and I’m talking about minutes he’s jumping, he’s whole, the fever breaks, he’s totally fine. And I remember also this was crazy; this was probably the most crazy thing I’ve ever seen we’re sitting at the dinner table there’s no food in the cupboards at all, no food in the refrigerator, no food in the cupboards one of the biggest stories that we told over the years that just blown me away. We’re at the table in South Phoenix, Arizona. My mother puts out the pots and pans and I found out the reason she did that is that Lord had reminded her of when the feeding of the 5000 she said “The Lord showed her how Jesus had the people sit down as though they were going to eat though there was nothing prepared they were going to bless the food. The Lord brought the two fish and the five loaves he set the people down, prepared them to eat.” My mother said “Set the children down and prepare them and pull out the pots and pans in faith like the two fish and five loaves if you will.” And so she pulls it out and you could only use water because that was all we had there’s nothing else in there it’s just water. While we’re sitting there at the table just kind of awkward knowing that there’s nothing in the cupboards the doorbell rings and my mother goes to the door. Now we grew up in a very kind of a very disciplined home so to turn around in your seat was not appropriate but I couldn’t help but to see what was going on because my mother was in the Spirit and when she’s in the Spirit like I said anything was about to happen. And my mother goes to the door and I turned around and look to see what was going to happen. When she opens the door I hear a car drive off and there are 12 bags of groceries around the doorstep, literally 12 bags. We go and help pull those bags in the house and my mother begins to cook and we ate. I’m telling you like it was a buffet, it was awesome.
Sid: Eddie you just keep provoking me to jealousy and you know the Bible says you’re job description the Christian is to provoke the Jew to jealousy, but our time is slipping away and I’ve got to have them experience the anointing on your music. Tell me very briefly about the song “I Am.”
Eddie: Well, “I Am” came to me by a dream; my pastor’s wife Phyllis Sawyer spoke to me and asked me to write a song with Jesus singing to us. And so when she said that no one taps into that anointing for something more than my pastor’s wife; she has this ability to push that button until something comes out. And so I went to bed that night and dreamed “I Am” literally Jesus singing to us and that’s what that song is about.
Sid: And Jesus in this singing over you let’s go to “I Am.”
Excerpt: “I Am”
Sid: Well, I don’t know about you but the anointing I mean Eddie prays and worships God so long a day that the anointing is out of sight…